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Vinson Institute Declines To Update Brookhaven Study

DeKalb CEO Ellis: "I am concerned that citizens now have incorrect data."


The Carl Vinson Institute of Government (CVI) has declined a request by to update its Brookhaven cityhood feasibility study using current tax digest values.

“I am concerned that citizens now have incorrect data, and I am disappointed that CVI will not adjust their revenue forecast,” Ellis said. “The feasibility study uses 2010 numbers, but the tax digest has fallen twice since then. The revenue estimates for the city of Brookhaven could be as much as 10 precent too high.”

In May, Ellis sent a letter to the CVI's local government program manager, Ted Baggett, asking for a supplement to the report that utilizes the actual proposed boundaries for the proposed city and the current tax digest. 

That request was denied as “…not feasible to complete…” prior to the July 31 referendum, according to the letter that CVI sent to Ellis.

Ellis has not gone on record as opposing the city of Brookhaven, but has urged a revamping of the system currently in place in Georgia for creating cities.

jjm1 June 13, 2012 at 04:49 AM
I kind of like hamburgers "glorified homeowners association" comment. Maybe we can drop this whole city thing and create the "Benevolent Brookhaven HOA". That way the YES folks can drive around in little golf carts and give out tickets for people who forget to cut their lawn.
"E Pluribus Unum" June 13, 2012 at 10:42 AM
So, why wouldn't anyone want to have revised, current data to evaluate a very important decision our community has to make on July 31? For any of the folks behind the Yes effort who say "this is not necessary," what are you afraid of? You say you want ethical, transparent, and responsive government, but when there is an opportunity to demonstrate these traits, you say not? Why? Your hypocrisy doesn't do much to convince me you will run a very ethical, transparent, and responsive government. So you now have an opportunity to possibly sway folks who are not sure of the reliability of the CVI study, and you don't support updating it? Finally, any revision using updated numbers has to be done by the group who performed the original study. If someone other than CVI offered an updated study, the Yes folks would scream not reliable. It's biased. It's politically motivated. You can't have it both ways. Show some honesty, integrity, backbone, and support an updated review by CVI.
Eddie E. June 13, 2012 at 11:52 AM
Probably because ethical, transparent and responsive government is just a ruse. They just want to be in charge of whatever government emerges, having been defeated in attempts to join the current government.
HamBurger June 13, 2012 at 11:55 AM
E Pluribus Unum, you would think that we would have had an immediate response stating that a revised Vinson study would be forthcoming. Rep. Jacobs did not wake up yesterday and find out about this, he has known for days, right after the Vinson folks contacted him regarding DeKalb County’s request. The hatred for DeKalb County is so great that they will do and say anything to create their new city instead of make positive changes to their existing government. Mr. Bill, in his 11:19 post points out a path that competent, concerned citizens would follow in creating a new city and observes that this path was not taken. The truth is the entire push for cityhood by a select few has been absent of a process designed to insure the success of a new city and this is the way their new city will be run if the vote passes July 31. Vote for a new city and this is just a small sampling of what you will be getting from your unannounced elected officials. Excuse me, I have to go start prepping my special hamburgers!
Eddie E. June 13, 2012 at 11:55 AM
And singular, non-contextual quotes from some point in the past are certainly more important than an open, public, raucous debate. Right?
Eddie E. June 13, 2012 at 12:07 PM
Or, it could be that the contributors at C4ND are a bit tapped out (remember, this was the entity that actually 'purchased' the flawed CVI Study). They should publish a list with contribution amounts so other willing citizens can show their solidarity, step forward and pony up for an ACCURATE study. But I still won't be holding my breath.
Eddie E. June 13, 2012 at 12:16 PM
Mr. Hamburger, More concisely, the entire process has been at best a handful of 'meetings' where the 'yessirs' took a few minutes to 'instruct' those in attendance what would occur. This process began to derail at the Oglethorpe meeting held by Rep. Parent last June, in which representatives of the GMA, ACC, and the County were present to provide INFORMATION, describe OPPORTUNITIES and suggest potential ALTERNATIVES. None of this kept with the 'resistance is futile' nature of the yes folks. At a Legislator's Town Hall meeting just before the start of the session, a certain unnamed Senator mentioned to a certain unnamed but omnipresent Commissioner's chief of staff "yep, it's just that Dunwoody Train comin' at 'em and they just don't know it yet". If the intent is to enforce a pre-determined outcome on an unsuspecting populace, apparently there is no need to spend time educating, listening or adjusting, after all, 'we have been given our instructions!'.
Max June 13, 2012 at 02:41 PM
Be nice to the OU students that Ms. Mesch is recruiting when they come to your door. They need the $10 per hour! Eric, applying a lawyers keen sense of logic to a political operatives motives and writings is not working. Pol ops (polyps) are paid to churn out 'messages' and twist the words of anyone who is not in agreement with their points of view. The messages I hear are: CVI study is flawed, inaccurate, and is being willfully kept out-of-date, Brookhaven will be a giant HOA, and everyone will be subject to whimsical laws, And then 'red herrings' are tossed in for good measure. Fact is, the CVI study is written conservatively, and while Brookhaven does not have Perimeter Mall like Dunwoody, the CVI study does not include Brookhaven Town revenues. Studies are needed for lawmakers to enable legislation; as such they are a 'snapshot' of financial variables at one point in time. Unlike Dunwoody, Brookhaven does not have ONE HOA that has provided years of careful, considered homeowner protection on zoning and governance issues. Brookhaven has several established HOA's and they all have a stake in this matter. Do your own research, believe half of what you hear, little of what you read (including my statements). Rep. Jacobs is an easy guy to speak with and is hugely accessible. Be polite, business-like and you'll get answers to your questions. But be nice to the OU kids, please...
HamBurger June 13, 2012 at 02:49 PM
No City Brookhaven May Rock Vote http://tinyurl.com/cfv2pqv Please pass the yellow mustard!
HamBurger June 13, 2012 at 04:23 PM
Brookhaven Cityhood Vote Preview: A Conversation with Melissa Weinman of the Brookhaven Reporter http://tinyurl.com/cc47a6r WABE’s Mr. Denis interviews Brookhaven reporter’s Ms. Melissa. Both audio tracks are well worth a listen with the longer track being more in-depth. Man! Those are some exceptional special hamburgers! Please pass the yellow mustard!
Max June 13, 2012 at 05:02 PM
The vote ultimately will reflect the fact that voter sentiment in Brookhaven is less homogenous than Sandy Springs or Dunwoody. Melissa answered questions in a reasonably objective manner in this interview, she is an impressive reporter. I am so curious to see how the vote will go!
Eric H June 13, 2012 at 05:24 PM
Hamburger...Good on. So where's my kleenex! Enuff Govt, thanks I appreciate the reasoned response. This is the stuff I enjoy. And I hear you. True on Life Insurance and undocumented workers. Though its not just life insurance but property and casualty insurance and we have high values on that - thus the reason we getter a higher HOST share of taxes than even Dunwoody. I would also note that much of the 12% poverty rate is the undocumented population and generally those in the poverty level aren't buying insurance anyway and our poverty % is lower than DeKalb's. Now....with apologies to Eddie E., I'll understand if you don't applaud, time to get on my soapbox! I hope people appreciate the struggle our undocumented neighbors go through simply to try to make a better life for themselves and their loved ones. If they were offered a pathway to legal status they would jump at the chance. Unfortunately some polticians have played to fears and scuttled immigration reform efforts. Botttom line right now they risk their lives to come to this great country. Its a very dangerous trip be it the elements or the criminals they must face. Once here they are not eligible for Welfare or Unemployment have social security and medicare taxes taken from their paychecks though they cannot collect it. Property taxes are paid via the apartments and of course they pay the HOST and SPlost and other sales taxes.
Eric H June 13, 2012 at 05:28 PM
Sorry I provided the link with the full quote, which I don't think dramatically changes anything but here is the full post so as to make sure I don't mislead by just quoting these lines . "I would only vote for the annexation option because of the island effect " Bill Lowe "It is good for DeKalb to have clean lines to patrol and essentially "locks in" the growth of the other cities." Bill Lowe 8:03 pm on Saturday, March 31, 2012 Not hypocritical. This is a reactive annexation because of the Brookhaven city lines. The area to be annexed into Chamblee will be surrounded by Doraville, Chamblee, and Brookhaven if Brookhaven becomes a city. If Brookhaven fails to become a city by public vote in July, then it is also possible that the Chamblee Annexation will fail as well. I like being a part of unincorporated DeKalb and don't have any major gripes with DeKalb County. I would only vote for the annexation option because of the island effect with I-85 being the crossing point into the neighborhoods for DeKalb county services. There would be few patrols of any Dekalb services when we are surrounded by other cities....Even police cut through traffic will diminsh to next to nothing if Brookhaven forms. Part 2 to follow
Eric H June 13, 2012 at 05:28 PM
Part 2 This is such a small area to be annexed in, it is not a huge financial loss to anyone except to those that feel that the DECA area is a part of Brookhaven...and that loss is all make believe. It is good for DeKalb to have clean lines to patrol and essentially "locks in" the growth of the other cities....Much like Brookhaven will be locked in, with no where else to expand to. Elena Parent did her job very well with the annexation bill. She came to the public neighborhood meetings and listened and agreed with our concerns. She kept the legislation local without having to rely on party affiliation to get it passed. Mike Jacobs could have done the same thing with Brookhaven.
Eric H June 13, 2012 at 05:31 PM
Yes its the diversity that gives me comfort that this won't be a city, if it happens, run by one group of folks.
Booyah June 13, 2012 at 05:40 PM
Don't you think, referring to the interviewer and reporter as Mr O'Hayer and Ms Weinman would be a bit more respectful ?
Eric H June 13, 2012 at 05:50 PM
Good stuff. Except at the end of Part 2 when she talks about islands and Deca. She forgot to mention the Chamblee Annexation vote that will wipe out the peninsula that Deca would be in if Brookhaven became a city. And that the relevant commercial base was dropped.
HamBurger June 13, 2012 at 06:34 PM
Mr. Eric, the immigration issue is a thorny one and I have no answers. However, I want to point out that several folks I know that have followed the rules to legally enter America, some with great difficulty, are quite angry when it is suggested we turn a blind eye to our immigration laws. The anchor baby issue really gets them worked up. Additionally, just using Mexico as one example, study how they handle illegal immigration in their country. Please pass the yellow mustard!
Eric H June 13, 2012 at 07:19 PM
Mr. Hamburger I've heard people say that before. The problem is that if you are from central america and do not have an immediate family member or employer to sponsor you there is no legal route into this country. I suspect your friends either had a parent or fiance or 21 year old or over child or had special skills there and an employer willing to sponsor them - or they came in under the Reagan Amnesty program. As to Anchor Baby nor sure what that means since several years ago the rules were changed and only Children over 21 can sponsor a parent. In other words crossing the border and having a child does not open the door to legal status since the baby is under 21. And yes its almost impossible to earn citizenship in Mexico, but its certainly easy to visit there and conditions for immigrants seeking to work in Mexico is much better. Actually Mexico's economy has improved somewhat and now immigration from Mexico (documented or undocumented) is basically at zero (as many people leaving as entering). As a result many folks from Honduras and neighboring countries are now entering Mexico to work. There's also the issue of our aging population. The main threat to Social Security is that are declining work force aged population in ratio to elderly is straining the system. Immigrants are of working age and thus the best way to increase the work force. Or we could do Santorums way of making white people have more babies.
Eric H June 13, 2012 at 07:22 PM
"Or we could do Santorums way of making white people have more babies." Eddie E, that's sarcasm. While Santorum basically said that I repeat it to mock him.
GuruLikeDrucker June 13, 2012 at 11:14 PM
Hamburger. I think I liked your Gabacho character better. Did you finally find out the true translation and change characters to save face? Seriously, bring him back and you could give him a catch phrase. Something like... pass the black beans! Bring back Gabacho and put HamBurger on the back burner.
"E Pluribus Unum" June 13, 2012 at 11:33 PM
Been trying to keep up with the posts today....a few observations to share. 1. The Yes fliers and robo call have really picked up this past week. Even one from MJ. I am taking this to mean they are concerned. If the alleged benefits are really that wonderful, why the oversell to sell the obviously, obvious good of Nirvanaville? 2. This full court pressure is expensive. I am becoming more interested in who sits behind the curtain. What are their motivations to invest sooo heavily in the "common good?" 3. After reading a few of Annie G's comments, it seems she is now taking on the traits of one 60-1. Wow. 4. Eric is a very 'verbose" scribe. He makes some interesting points, but sometimes it seems he comes full circle with his perspectives. I wonder if he talks the same way as he writes? I would love for Eric to write in 20 words or less, why or why not city hood? 5. I'm surprised sometimes at the amount folks worry about "who" said something rather then "what" they had to say. My life experience has taught me when difficult messages are being delivered to arrogant, self absorbed people, the immediate "who said it" signals intent to retaliate. 6. Ali S from PC had some very important insights for us to consider. 7. HamBurger, Eddie E. Carl, Enuff have all been consistently clear and on point with their messages. No, I am not logging in and using their names either.
HamBurger June 13, 2012 at 11:57 PM
Mr. GuruLikeDrucker, I also enjoy the “French Idiot” as he says those that know him best call him. However, I do not run in the same social circles as he does, much to my regret. There are several of us out here that would to share a feast and some adult beverages with him. To many, his posts may border on gibberish at first glance. However, words do mean something and to those that pay attention, there is a message. Thank you for the compliment, but he is not me . . . By the way, the best Cuban is at the house . . . Special hamburger anyone?
Eddie E. June 14, 2012 at 04:11 AM
EPU, Clear as a bell. I am still waiting on the C4ND donor lists to see who is behind this, but of course the end of June will tell us who and how much is forcing this plan (gosh those cheesy mailers remind me of the cheesy Jill Chambers mailers). Who is behind that curtain? And last, to point's 1 and 2 again, call it what it is, 'Just Say No to Jacobshaven!'
Eddie E. June 14, 2012 at 04:16 AM
Eric, I digress from my Hero, Mr. Hamburger in that I feel there is a solution....Arrest the employers of illegals, try and convict them for the felony of hiring illegals, auction off their stuff to citizens who will obey the law and eliminate the attractant. To those in the Dun-Jilted crescent, this does mean that you will either have to clean your own house and maintain your own lawn, or pay CITIZENS a legitimate and living wage to do it for you.
Eric H June 14, 2012 at 03:44 PM
Eddie E. If you make it a Felony to hire undocumented workers, would you also be in favor of some sort of pathway to legal status or are you instead trying to force a "voluntary" deportation of several million people (Many of whom have been here since Children) by further changing the rules midstream. BTW I didn't hear you applauding!
Eric H June 14, 2012 at 03:59 PM
Happy to Oblige E Pluribus: Why Cityhood in under 20 words. User friendly delivery of services covered, Better Parks, More sidewalks, Sustainable Land Use and Development Practices, Increased Property Values. Yea guilty on being verbose, round about in that I try to acknowledge your guys points when you make them vs. spurious attacks or snide comments. I wish people would actually respond to the point at hand more often. Oh well it is what it is. I agree Hamburger and Enuff have made some valid points. Why is Peachtree Corners more telling than the other 5 Vinson Studies? Will be interesting to see who "ponied" up for Brookhaven No ;-) (note I have no problems with legally operating clubs and believe in grandfathering if rules are changed).
HDM June 14, 2012 at 03:59 PM
More personal attacks. Why can't you stick to the issues Eddie? Personal attacks do no one any good.
HDM June 14, 2012 at 04:01 PM
I agree, the ethnicity, political leanings and other orientations of citiznes in Brookhaven will lead to a diverse, multi-cultural, world class city.
HamBurger June 19, 2012 at 08:55 PM
Mr. Eric, I think you are a little off with your numbers . . . Special hamburger and Cheerwine?

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