Konas belongs to gated subdivisions and builds gated apartment communites! Gated gated gated: the Konas way! Where does he get those fancy tan suits! Ugh...

Good questions Mr. Gokce!

I for one would sue for an 'omit'.

Mr. Charles A. Konas is Executive Vice President - Construction and Property Services of Post Properties, Inc., as such I find it hard to believe that he "offered that he never had met Burrell Ellis"..........Really ??
http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/officerProfile?symbol=PPS&officerId=1448496

Personal attacks from the Tories like this is all they have folks. Anyone on the fence will read this nonsense and see right through it.

Voters won't fall for the name calling, Brookhaven cityhood is for the best for citizens.

Who in their right mind would want a major regional tennis center in a residential neighorhood on Ashford Dunwoody where there is already too much traffic congestion.

I'm glad we don't have the white elephant that ended up going next to Stone Mountain in Snellville. That's a money drain right now.

Keep in mind these things are very expensive to maintain.

Professor only you and Ms. Mesh are the only people I've seen complain about not having the Tennis Center and you've both directed it at the Stan Seagal. If you are Ms. Mesh why not engage in discussion under your first or full name?

It's interesting that a large portion of the No people post anonymously, while a large portion of the Yes people either use their first name or full name.

@Eric, You are 'spot on' Ms Mesh is the ONLY one who brings up a 15 year old issue
about Olympic Tennis Centers. There is no doubt Professor is Ms Laurenthia Mesh.

Slick salary! HA! Coucil members will make $14k a year and mayor $16k.

Professor--"snakes"? "curmudgeons?" Liars? I have always found that when you think you have a valid argument using name calling, you really do NOT have an argument.Try using facts and not scurrilous opinions to present your case. Try getting No City Brookhaven to have an OPEN meeting so they can have a forum dedicated to their point of view and answering as many questions without sharing the podium.

Try being civil.

I know it must be hard to hold back considering the individuals you are discussing!

AMEN, he is known for coming up with his Facts.

Harry,
Most people HAVE adequate police protection.
Most people are not willing to pay for 'boutique' police protection to handle crimes of opportunity generated by foolish behavior.

Funny Gilligan, every thing i have seen and heard so far points the contrary........No people shot themselves in the foot.....now they really don't have a leg to stand on.

No City came across as pessimists. They are not happy with the County--and emphasized they were not pro-county, but were scared about the unknowns of a new city. My observation was that NO City sounded like pessimistic victims that are willing to be stuck with known county corruption and failings because it MAY be better than what a new City might evolve into. Sort of "better to stay with the devil that you know than the devil that you do not know"

Surprisingly, imo, NO City side strongly implied that those in the audience complaining about lack of recent representation with the County that it was THEIR FAULT because "the squeaky wheel gets the grease". That if you organize and repeatedly present your case and force the commissioner in question to be constantly reminded, you will be heard. (This was during the conversation that each current commissioner represents 166,000 constituents vs. 10,000 per council member in a new city).

I think that inadvertently the remonstration that you would get more attention if you worked at it supported the idea of more local and focused representation.

Professor,
It was a long shot for the 'yesser's to start with.
Most folks have made up their mind already that this plan is a genuine fools errand and attempting to pack the house with stock lame 'yesser' questions doesn't change the bare and obvious fact that there is NO CASE HERE.
The best sales job the 'yesser's can muster won't sell this bag of snakes but they are unlikely to pack up their signs and go away.

Funny how the "Sierra Club" does not promote public parks? Could this be true Eddie?

not one, (or should I say, Mr. Clayton, non-genius),

You do comprehend the difference between 'wilderness' and the artificial nature of a 'public park' don't you?

Eddie: Been to muir Woods Plernty. Last time I was there there were hundreds of people maintenance crews, paths, etc,etc,etc! Parks are good for people and society! I would think most in the Sierra club would agree. Atlanta has a LONG history of segregation and CC settings instead of linking open space, via greenways: IE: the Boston Commons, minneapolis Grand Rounds, Boulder Colorados Greenways! But you have the gated and enclave of the Capital City Club Piedmont Driving Club, et al!

Also your arguments over and over and over again about the moeny do not fly. brookhaven would get to keep and spend their tax dollars! Instead of dolling it to S dekalb and bloated officials and pensions!

not much,
So what (if anything) is your point?
What does that have to do with the alchemy of the Opposed City turning (what some people see as) lead into (what those same people are deluded into believing they can create) gold?
I would be all for keeping green space and especially STREAM BUFFERS protected from unnecessary development and encroachment, but if I remember right, the County Commissioner who serves the 'Dun-Jilted Crescent' is one of the first in the State to vote for violation of County Ordinance TO ENCROACH ON A STREAM BUFFER.
Is the menu you guys pick-and-choose from available for public amusement?

FYI: I dont support Ms Boyer or any other yahoo running agaisnt her. I support local citizens managing local zoning & planning decisions; building sidewlaks, parks, opaths, tree islands traffic circles, etc. I do not support the South Dekalb memebers that make up the Deklab School Board and the BOC, they do not live in my neighborhood and they do not care about me nor us. And the feeling is mutual!
Are you connected to Lithonia or Stonecrest?

not much,
So if my interpretation is correct, you don't support anything that solves the problem and are, in the meantime, busy chasing windmills.
I see how that mindset could make one angry with the County and all the rest of reality.

Phil,

You seem to have some sort of fixation with Mr. Konas's honorable employment.
As an anonymous poster, I wonder who you are and what you do for a living.

And for the life of me, I can't understand why this keeps getting pulled?
Are you a regular advertiser in one of the driveway lump 'newspapers'?

More obvious fact Bill.
Is there a place to keep the FACTS listed in this discussion or does it always have to be prefaced with nonsense like 'local control'?

Facts for Eddie:
"While county operating budgets have been hit hard by the recession, the $96 million from the 2005 Parks Bond have been spent in recent years to develop state-of-the-art facilities, many in places previously underserved by the county.

The DeKalb CEO’s publication “One DeKalb: 2011-2012 Report to Stakeholders” features many of the bond expenditures: $5.7 million for the Redan Recreation Center, $6.3 million for the Exchange Recreation Center, $3.2 million spent to develop Mason Mill Park (where the CEO wants to build a Soap Box Derby Race track), $1.3 million to improve Flat Shoals Park and $1.2 million to build a new YMCA at Wade Walker Park. The $1.5 million for Murphey Candler softball and the $11 million money promised for Brook Run Park in Dunwoody (where only $ 4 million has been spent and is a subject of litigation) are the only parks north of I-85 to receive county bond money." http://www.thecrier.net/news/article_67834d90-b4bd-11e1-9bd8-0019bb2963f4.html

Another Fact:
County spends $480k a year in park maintenance in parks in footprint of city. The city would be viable even spending almost three times as much (CVI).

Another Fact:
"The Browns Mill Family Aquatic Center is more than a neighborhood pool. It’s a watery amusement park, complete with twin water slides that tower three stories above the pool, kiddie water slides, a snack bar and picnic tables." http://www.helloatlanta.com/attractions/browns_mill_family_aquatic_center_makes_a_big_splash/201880/

Where's our neighborhood water park?

annie:

The No folks belong to gated clubs so they do not need public spaces; The certain XXL one's who cannot aford membership mow medians on the weekends...

Actually Murphey Candler Park has a many aspects to it. The south end is the organized league park that I agree is justifiably kept up by the leagues, justifiably because Dunwoody residents who don't pay into the parks budget maybe the biggest users of the league.
But Murphey Candler is also a huge passive park with Shelters and a trail that goes around the lake both of which attract workers from the Perimeter Center (its abuts Perimeter Center) and surrounding neighborhoods.
There is an active Parks Pride group for the passive part and its been very very difficult working with the county because of the bureaucracy. The playground equipment is dilapidated, Trash, especially near the camp shelters needs to be picked up more often.
And of course their is also the DeKalb Public pool, that is the ONLY pool closed to the neighborhood on Sundays for rental to outside groups.
The County rarely communicates with the known neighborhood contacts regarding the park. Which then leads to having to react after something happens.

As to the same problems arising if a city was formed. Well that's not what happened on all 3 sides of the proposed city of Brookhaven with Sandy Springs, Dunwoody and Chamblee's Annexation. In all 3 areas things improved dramatically.

Its real tough to merely discount what actually happened with the 3 other areas right next door to us.

Annie,
You refer to the CVI, do you mean the 'original (inaccurate) CVI, the jacobs-adjusted CVI, the CVI using real revenue and expense numbers (that has not ever been produced) or a new plan accurately reflecting the Tax Digest, probable rates of collection and realistic expense numbers for the 'services' suggested for the Opposed City.
If you refer to the CVI, please use some sort of disclaimer like 'not a factual statement'.

Of course in the interest of FULL DISCLOSURE my only contact in over 30 years of living here with either Blackburn Park or Murphy Candler Park was to drive by, as I had no reason whatsoever to go there.
If no change means it does not cost me any more money, then yet another reason...
No Means NO!

"County spends $480k a year in park maintenance in parks in footprint of city. The city would be viable even spending almost three times as much (CVI)."
Annie, yes!
People argue over if the ultimate taxes would be a little more or a little less each year but what they forget is that the calculation of taxes is based on a projection of vastly increased spending on things like Parks, Roads, Sidewalks and Drainage.
Yes some people refuse to recognize the reality and testimony from Dunwoody, Sandy Springs and Johns Creek that the Carl Vinson numbers are conservative and they ignore the number crunching that indicates Brookhaven's numbers are also conservative (did not include Town Center, Revenues from 75% of projected sources have risen more than the decline in the revenues from 25% of projected revenues aka property tax digest).
Besides increased efficiency derived from the compact city of 12 square miles that is laid out in a very serviceable geometric pattern (fairly neatly rectangular) the ability to increase spending will combine to improve the services that would shift from the County to the City. And in turn hopefully the services that remain with the County would improve as the County Government would have less responsibilities and thus better able to focus on those responsibilities.

Eric,
Repeating the same 'talking points' doesn't change the obvious fact.
An Opposed City would INCREASE each of our annual costs of ownership or occupation of a residence or business. The myth of a reduction has been entirely debunked.
There will NOT be sufficient revenue for ADEQUATE Police AND parks AND roads and drainage (but a new municipality would probably be broadsided with storm water cost phase-in that would empty a few more commercial structures when the costs were inevitably passed on).
Lather, rinse, repeat, but the pig is still dirty.

Eddie not talking points but facts.

Though I will say typing in Caps and using emotionally laden language without any substance certainly doesn't support an argument to vote against a city.

Eric,
As you wish.
I seek proof and have no faith without it.
You are welcomed to expound in the same circle, over, and over, and over, but that does not change the story.
Nor does it prove anything.

That would be awesome!

Randy,

There is absolutely no chance (a new milton county probably has a better chance and that is still zero).

I don't think there is much chance of that. Dunwoody's Mayor had an interesting comment on that however. He said that while the city has a small voice over school matters its more of a voice than what existed before.

Randy - A preliminary concept for a charter school system was first floated by a former state senator - Dan Weber - in about 2007. I don't think he is advocating for it, but I have heard Larry Danese discuss studying a charter school system that would initally include Dunwoody, Chamblee and (proposed) Brookhaven, based on the Weber concept using our established frame work of schools. Don't know if the idea is developed, and it may not go anywhere, but I liked the concept. Something has to change with the school board/system so that our students can compete locally and nationally. The current school superintendent is doing a good job of reducing admin staff, but I suspect that she is being subverted by those that remain.

SayWhat?thank you, but I get into plenty enough trouble all by myself and don't need the help. Charter schools, and charter school systems, can be as continuous a subject as is the Brookhaven issue and I would like not to go there (I mean other than the 6 emails I already have.) I have worked a bit on the charter school system concept, but it is not an issue in the Commission race and neither should it be. There appears to be support for a careful study by qualified persons who consider the merits, the reasons that some charter schools have failed, the extent of local controls on management and performance metrics and the reasonable boundaries of such a system. I do not know of any current initiative to consider such a system.

The current charter absolutely does NOT talk about any services. Read it for yourself. Nothing! No services at all. AND no budget either. "Trust me" those Yesers say! HA!

No chance of a city school system, unless you rewrite the state constitution. Don't hold your breath there either.

Milton County would also require a rewrite of the state consititution and a state-wide referendum. Not likely either.

Gracias: SM

I'd rather have no budget any day, any year any decade, any century, any millennium - than the Corrupt leaders abusing and using funds for soap box derbys and massive clear cutting of native North Georgia woodlands...where the Cherokee darter roams - The Sierra Club likely approves of this too: Right Eddie E?!

It was obvious early on that the sales job for cities of:
Ashford
Lynwood
South Dunwoody
Dun-Jilted
would be even more impossible than this nonsense so might as well grab for the on that at least has a major crossroads.

anon, don't get caught up in the name, the reality is that Brookhaven is US, it is your neighbors in the area banding together to provide a more responsive more fiscally responsible government representation.

Dean,
My 'neighbors' aren't bound and determined to force my neighborhood into a hopeless financial death spiral.
Maybe yours are.
In any case I will be glad on August 1st when the inevitable defeat is announced and we can all go back to being our potty little selves.

Yes, 'resident' we have all lived here for a very long time.
How about yourself?
I moved here because I like being unencumbered by a glorified homeowners association and I have not encountered any reasons to change that.
Tell me, o enlightened one, what governmental structure in what location does not respond to the largest (or loudest) group of constituents. It seems that even you guys example of a 'beacon' (Dunwoody) seems to have had a bit of council upheaval and confrontation with the truth of late.

Nope they do not!

The person going by the name "Professor" has peppered his posts with name calling. He's called the Brookhaven Yes folks snakes, liers, snaky, and curmugeons. How come you are not removing them?

Tim,
Please report on this:
http://web.co.dekalb.ga.us/portals/news-room/a_release.asp?filePK=1551

Additionally, he person here: Not one of 60 is abusing this forum. Please have him removed.

1) My 'neighbors' are in the 81st State House District (south of Peachtree).
2) The 'citation' is up to interpretation. Wouldn't the yessers be angry to see how badly they had been manipulated should the Opposed City accidentally win and the HOST money goes away?
3) Good for him, everyone needs a fantasy to chase.

Where is there even a claim that a City of Brookhaven would not get HOST dollars? Everything I've read says that when the city of Dunwoody legislation passed it included language that provided for Dunwoody and any city formed after Dunwoody to receive its share of HOST dollars.

Is this another claim pulled out of thin air? Eddie can you provide more details or a line of logic that leads even questioning if a city of Brookhaven would receive HOST funds?

Eric,
Claim pulled from thin air?
Have you been paying attention?
There is substantial doubt as to what point of the HOST credits the Opposed City might receive.
Just as there is doubt about the Tax Digest, the Tax Rate, the clear, obvious and irrefutable FACT that property taxes in the Opposed City would INCREASE over the unincorporated County.
You might need a couple more sticks to prop up the house of cards, for it is up to you guys to prove this and not up to the rest of us to count on your 'hope'.
No means NO!

Eddie, Which is it, first you said the "HOST money goes away", now you are saying its a question of when? Yes I am aware there is a question of when the HOST funds will be received but that's entirely different than saying the "HOST money goes away." That you've now changed your story is just another example of you making an incorrect statement and not admitting it.

I'm sorry to take this tone, but your tactics are something I would expect of an anonymous poster. We have enough issues and facts to hash out without having to deal with baseless comments.

What doubt is there about the Tax Digest? DeKalb county updated the numbers for this portion (25%) of expected city revenues while conveniently not updating any of the other numbers. Including the expected share of HOST funds a City of Brookhaven would receive.

Uncertainty about the Tax Rate? Unlike DeKalb we know there is a millage cap on the property tax rate that we would have to vote to raise. The only uncertainty is would it be lower. That's an uncertainty I'm more than willing to accept.

"obvious and irrefutable FACT that property taxes in the Opposed City would INCREASE over the unincorporated County. " Eddie come on breath, read your own words and think. No one knows which will end up being higher, yes its going to be close. But we don't know the exact HOST credit and we don't know if B'haven's millage rate will be set below the cap.

It's not Hope, its a proven formula for success.

Eric,
Do you work in a laundromat because, Dude you can really spin!

You have not PROVEN anything.
You have shown that a bad idea rejected by the majority of citizens can be presented in a variety of views to make it more appealing.
Yet it remains an idea that the majority of citizens never wanted, had no intention of supporting and now is clearly much more expensive than continuing along the established path and working hard to correct the small number of annoying faults.

It does amaze me that despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, you are driven to invent new scenarios on a daily basis attempting to 'prove' some financial advantage that has inherent costs and perils that far outweigh any tiny pittance of 'envisioned' tax savings.

Eddie is it really that difficult for you to answer a question?

Which is it? Are you saying that Brookhaven may not get HOST dollars or is it a merely a timing of the payment.

And which of my statements is a Spin and why do you think that?

What new scenario did I Invent?

You may think you are clever with your insults or perhaps you think it hides the lack of substance or your lack of willingness to engage in a civil and straight forward conversation.

Look I understand you are mad at Chamblee because you don't like their attempts to require businesses to comply with their new development rules in an attempt to make their streets more inviting to street/environmentally friendly development, bikers or pedestrians. And I understand you don't want a city because you are afraid they will tell you what to do. But that's not an excuse to post the way you do. Even if you feel you've been wronged by the Brookhaven Yes folks or Mike Jacobs that doesn't make what you are doing right. Two wrongs do not make a right. Your constant refusal to even try to rationally discuss matters is something anonymous posters do.

Excluding anonymous posters who are anonymous so so that they can be idiots or lie you are the one person on this board who I think .... oh never mind.

http://brookhavenfacts.wordpress.com/

She's busy decorating her strip mall! very interesting county fair sheik...

Certainly sounds expensive doesn't it.

That is actually a great question to which I did not know the answer. Glad you posted it. Resident 30319 explained, below: the total expense budget for a member of the City Council is $3,000 as per HB636. Makes sense since these are not full time or either part time people.

Annie,
That means it would take several years to pay off the 'golden golf cart' throne now doesn't it.

The charter doesn't rule out additional expenses for the Mayor and council. The CVI projected (based on Johns Creek and Dunwoody's expenses) a total budget for costs related to 1 mayor and 6 council people of $215,000. . We've since reduced the number to 1 mayor and 4 council people. But at 7 positions that amounts to costs of $30,714 for each position. Which should include the $8,000 plus $3,000 for compensation and incurred expenses per Council position and and $16,000 salary and $12,000 in incurred expenses for the mayor.

I do think this is the one area one could call overlap with the county, since its not like police or parks where we are shifting duties (Dekalb will still have 7 commissioners and 1 CEO). Though as more of the county incorporates like Fulton, and the County focuses on what it does best I would expect cutbacks in the commission staffing and expense levels, same with the CEO.

But for now $215,000 works out to under $4.50 per year for every person, I would hope and push for the people we elect to adopt a budget that cuts that figure in half, especially since we are funding 2 less positions, but even at $215,000 its worth it to get better decision making on land use, zoning, permitting, code enforcement, police and parks.

Though we should ask a candidate running for mayor and the council slots to take a stand on what the Mayor's and council budget should be.

You should open records the generous dekalb benefits...bloated family and friends program....traditional pension, early out, no co pays! life is good on the tax payer dime, raise taxes always but never cut benefits....

Eddie works part time at dekalb like all of the deaklb workers part time 40 hours a week; part time on break...

Bill,

Excellent observations.
Now take a moment and speculate just how this same crowd (who already envisions themselves as 'in charge') would behave if the Opposed City accidentally came to be?
After all, look at the degree of hostility that is derived from simply asking questions rather than doing what we are told.

I guess that is what is to be expected when a 'moderator' doesn't take their job seriously and allows those who buy ads to take over.

@Bill I was up on the stage and saw Mr Mayer pointing to people as well. I couldn't tell if the guy with the microphone was paying any attention to him. My impression is that both sides got some tough questions and some softball questions. But is wasn't orchestrated. I didn't have a play book, just a few notes I had jotted down.

Just an observation from a future Chamblee resident...LOL!

Bill still has his feelings hurt over his area not being able to be included in Brookhaven.

Dean, reading comprehension can be difficult. Let's restate it for you again, because I have answered this bait from you more than once.

If I wanted to live in Brookhaven, I would. That would be the actual part of Brookhaven, not some make believe area North of Windsor Parkway, or anything South of the halfway point down Dresden. I have the means to do so, it's all a matter of personal preference and priorities. If you ask about those, I will be happy to explain them to you as well.

If the DECA area was going to be included within the city of Brookhaven, it would have been from the beginning. Unfortunately for C$ND, they chose to cherry pick the commercial properties and leave ALL of the residential areas out of the proposed city. DECA spoke out about this and gave C$ND a choice: Either include the residential areas of DECA within Brookhaven, or remove the commercial properties. C4ND chose to remove the commercial pieces.

It is because of the poor planning of the creation of the city, poor communication, and a lack of consideration of all those involved in the creation of this city that I speak out against it and believe that it will be run similarly to how it is being created.

By the way....When this fails by a wide margin(Recent Telephone Poll), you can expect the other half of the CID inside of 285 to be annexed into Dunwoody leaving out all of the residential. Dunwoody knows they have a legal right to it now, they are just being nice.

Mr. Bill, your fourth paragraph (10:45 pm post) resonates with a lot of people in the footprint of the proposed city. It also brings to mind a few words from Rep. Mike Jacobs’s initial news letter back in June of 2007:

“Openness and straight talk are the hallmarks of good public service.

When I first ran to be your State Representative, I walked every neighborhood in our State House district to ask for your vote and provide you with direct answers to your questions. Since then, those who have seen me in action in our community know that I have continued to deliver openness and straight talk as hallmarks of my legislative service.

When you ask me a question, even in the most public setting, you get an unvarnished answer. When you send me an e-mail, you receive a direct response from me personally.

That’s the way public service should be.”

Handled differently, this cityhood issue may well have had a much better reception. As it is, neighbors and communities have been pitted against each other. If this cityhood vote passes, it will be the beginning of our dysfunctional end.

Special hamburger and a Cheerwine?

Mr. Bill, this meeting was very poorly moderated.

- There was no clear statement of the rules.
- There were no observed time limits.
- Interruptions were allowed from the audience.
- Questioners were not allowed to ask for clarifications.
- Many questioners repeated themselves instead of getting to the point.
- As a result, this meeting turned into a BY pep rally.
- Indeed there appeared to be preferred individuals selected for questions.
- Better organized and managed, this forum would have been much more productive.

You know, Rep. Mike Jacobs had a revision made to the Vinson study earlier this year. You would think an elected official interested in open and transparent government would have the Vinson study updated for the voters to review prior to this upcoming important vote.

Posted elsewhere is a request for more of these forums. I see no advantage until we have a revised Vinson study. We may not make much money, but we would have a better time if we just went to Las Vegas.

Man! Those are some fine thin sliced onions!

Hamburger you get what you pay for. The Reporter Newspaper was nice enough to try to do this free meeting to allow both sides to present their side of the story. This was a 3rd party effort and some accommodation to them should be made even if you don't think they moderated it well.

Eric,
So at least we agree that public policy should not be made in collusion with the 'driveway lump newspapers'?

Shoot Eddie why should I answer your question since you never answer my questions.

But ok, fine, I'll answer your question. Yes "public policy should not be made in collusion with the 'driveway lump newspapers'"

But I don't know which paper you are speaking of or what policy has been made in collusion with said newspaper. But I agree with the general principle.

So how about answering one of my questions now? Like were you wrong or just use bad wording when you said Brookhaven may not ever get HOST dollars?

Eric,
As far as the HOST money, I don't know how much it would be, how it would be allocated or how far it would go in attempting to close the ever yawning budget hole developing for the imaginary Opposed City (nor do you).
It probably won't make a difference, but it has been fun to watch you guys pretend HOST would be the hopeful rabbit pulled from the hat of lofty assumptions to make people believe the fatally flawed would somehow function.

With each revelation, there is a fresh package of hopeful assumptions to paper over the realities of the revelation. For instance:
Bad data = bad CV study, no problem, adjust the data (nobody really knows which data set was used or what the projected outcome was).
Errors in the CVI exposed = No problem, the yessirs will provide whatever casts the best light on the erroneous study, after all, the study is just an 'outline'.
Changes in the tax digest = Invent a new set of probabilities (and throw HOST calculations that are little more than a SWAG). Pretend all is well.
New tax rates from the County = Pretend the County will raise taxes faster than the Opposed City. Remember, the Opposed City hasn't faced any real, transparent scrutiny because it is just so much hot air.
In short:
Lower taxes - False (higher taxes, overall higher occupation costs).
More Police - No chance (without a much larger Police budget).
Better parks - Not after the budget has been eviscerated to cover the Police
Local Control - Not with these locals!

Ok so you seem to be admitting that you mispoke when you questioned if Brookhaven would get any HOST funds. Why would you say that?

"As far as the HOST money, I don't know how much it would be,....(nor do you)."
The CVI study's formula made sense to me, what do you think is wrong about it? And if HOST's proceeds went up 10 or 20% why do you think our share of the proceeds wouldn't go up? And if the estimates in the CVI study were wrong or the estimate of the increase was wrong why doesn't the county say something like they did with property taxes. I'm comfortable with the CVI's analysis and that the increase in HOST revenues will increase the decline in property tax revenues.

"Bad data = bad CV study" What data is bad?
"Errors in the CVI exposed = " What errors in the CVI were exposed?

"Changes in the tax digest = Invent a new set of probabilities (and throw HOST calculations that are little more than a SWAG)." Swag? 20-25% of revenues is swag? Again if Revenues went up 10-20% why would our share go up in line with that?

"New tax rates from the County = Pretend the County will raise taxes faster than the Opposed City. " How much are you paying for County Bonds that never should have been passed or were not spent well? isn't it true we can't exceed the millage cap in Brookhaven without a vote but DeKalb can do another 26% increase without a vote? Do you really think there is not more protection from increased taxes in a city of Brookhaven?

"Lower taxes - False (higher taxes, overall higher occupation costs)." Ok for homeowners because DeKalb just raised the HOST Credit to 59% Brookhaven may not be able to beat Unincorporated DeKalb's rate. But for businesses and rental properties the property tax will be lower because they don't get the HOST info. And this 59% info just came out.

"More Police - No chance (without a much larger Police budget)."
We will have more Police patrolling our streets. http://brookhavenfacts.wordpress.com/
"Better parks - Not after the budget has been eviscerated to cover the Police"
The projected spending triples spending on parks, cut it in half if its decided we need to spend more elsewhere, or spend less overall we are still spending more.
Same with the projected large increases in Road spending.
"Local Control - Not with these locals!" So you are saying a majority of the people in the proposed city of Brookhaven that would cover our homes will elect unaccountable people or bad people? Though even aside from whose elected local control also means more direct control that is more efficient and user friendly.

Mr. Eric, “you get what you pay for” does not apply here. You do what you have to do to elevate your brand and show that you are a player in your market. This was one of those unique times when no one had to pay, just donate your time. The panelists, the audience, and the hosts just had to show up at Oglethorpe University for an informative evening. A successful forum would have meant a lot to BR.

A news paper hosted a forum and it was their opportunity to shine and add to their credibility. But, that did not happen. Who were the losers? The attendees.

Please pass the yellow mustard!

Eric,
This is pointless isn't it.
You have a 'product' to sell, and I don't under any circumstances want to buy it.
You lean on the 'yessirs' website for 'facts' and it should be obvious to you I place no value whatsoever in the yessirs definition of 'fact'.

You need to stop for a moment and remember, it is up to the pro city crowd to MAKE THE CASE where this is a slam dunk, guaranteed, opportunity for long-term improvement for ALL of the area residents.
I realize your frustration, as that case cannot be made. The facts do not even begin to support it.
The sad part is that as the reality has become obvious, there has been no interest in anything from the 'yessirs' but to double-down on the propaganda and pretend that anyone who disagrees is being 'insulting'.

It has become truly pathetic.

Eric,
And as to the 'locals', I am referring to 'those who would be king'.
Our area is filled with qualified and capable leaders with the ability to LISTEN to their neighbors and friends and develop solutions. Unfortunately, those people have no interest in politics, especially in anything to do with the Opposed City.
Those who have stepped forward so far lack a clear comprehension of broad public opinion and I, for one, would not vote for any of them.

Yea Hamburger, true. My you get what you pay for quip though was a reference to the fact it was free. Thank goodness the Brookhaven Reporter is here though, imagine if it was the Neighbor Newspaper / Marietta Daily Journal?

Eddie I don't lean on the Brookhaven Yes websites, though I think that link I posted about the police coverage makes valid points. I mean I see it with my own eyes, coverage in the newly incorporated areas has risen dramatically over when it was DeKalb providing coverage, yet by the numbers the DeKalb Police force should have a greater presence. Personally I from the dealings I've had and people I know, (unscientific yes) I think there's a lot of police not on the street.

What I do lean on is the CVI study, I've got that saved and the city charter saved as well as the current financials and CVI study for Dunwoody. I understand many complaints about the proposed city and Brookhaven Yes but what I don't buy is the notion that its not fiscally feasible. Yes we are not Dunwoody, but then again Dunwoody has many similarities to us and offers some very helpful guidance or evidence.

Yes I agree to convince people to vote for change, those for the city carry the burden of proof. However that doesn't relieve those opposed to the city from being held to a standard of accuracy or having a reasonable basis for making statements.

Elayne,

You may have come up with a slogan for the Opposed City Limits Sign:

"Jacobshaven, Shameful and Selfish"

W/E Elayne or whatever your nayme...Give me all of your money elayne...you need to take care of the poor

Frankly, Elayne, if DeKalb were a reliable, efficiently representative government there would be no need for the city. Pigs may some day fly too.

total bunk...Should SF, NYC and other elite World class cities rich "take care of" newwark and oakland?! Elayne - sounds like a made of nayme..., anyway nice try now go get your biscuit from Ellis...

San Francisco (county) DOES include Oakland.

Thx elayne best wishes in Brookhaven, er south Deadkab...I don't support corruption I loathe it, therefore I loathe many no peeps no and forever and ever and ever, elayne is not my name, my parents do not make up naymes....

SF is also incorporated (Just liek Brookhaven will be) and we will still be in dekalb county - so 88% of your taxes will still help the poor in South Dekalb, don't feel so bad elayme...only 12 % of your tax dollars will go to a 12 square mile Brookhaven become a better place! Sort of like a big HOA!

Did you know SF is only 7 Sqaure miles! now thats some real good tufu! How's about that!

Can you point me to where you get those numbers? What is the total distribution?

Until DeKalb jacks up taxes again in a year or two

Amazing how the No City Brokhaven mirrors the County posting which mirros the flier by No City Brookhaven. But, those rumors about them unlawfully working together (which are based on the County Lobbist saying he was working with the opposition) have been denied....

Dunwoody is in DeKalb County. If taxes in DeKalb County are lowered for this year than Dunwoody residents benefit. And since all the benefits of HOST accrue to city residents as they do to County residents, Dunwoody will win again. This is not a game, please don't misrepresent. HOST credit is collected from everyone in DeKalb, and is distributed to everyone.

Ms. Annie, the information in the news release linked above regarding DeKalb County millage rates for 2012 was first posted on the DeKalb County website on 06/26/2012. If you are computer savvy you can figure this out. Item D1. under finance is where you want to go.

http://agenda.co.dekalb.ga.us/cache/00003/026/071012.pdf

In a post (07/07/2012) on the Patch article “The Mayor of Brookhaven” I basically gave you the lowest to highest standing of Unincorporated DeKalb, Dunwoody, and Proposed Brookhaven. This was by no means a secret.

People that are involved with their government would have known where to find this information. Some involved DeKalb citizens receive e-mails from their county commissioners that notify them of upcoming BOC meetings with links to this information as an effort to keep them informed. Or, if you are not involved in keeping an eye on your government, you may just want to continue whining . . . Makes me wonder just how many of the Brookhaven Yes folks knew about this information last night.

Regardless, if you do get a new government, you will have to make yourself involved to get what you want as they will not be sending out special invitations, Mr. Dean.

What a special day! Plenty of special hamburger smoke and plenty of special hamburgers! Please pass those thin sliced onions!

Deadkalb is corrupt and hamburgers cause cancer, Oprah was right. Please eat vegies.

Interesting, the county is running at a deficit but they are able to do this. Well if nothing else the Brookhaven movement has rung out some tax savings.

I do question the math in the table since our millage for city services even if at the cap of 3.35 would still get the state exemption plus the extra 10,000 exemption so you have to factor that in. After all the 59% exemption is not totally funded by HOST but also has an element of the state exemption in there.

One thing I didn't realize before is that Dunwoody had an exemption of $10,000 plus 1 mil off of assessed value so it really works out to 1.74? Interesting.

yea but Hamburger you guys knew about the 59% Host Credit well before today, when this information was released.

Mr. Eric, really? Do you think this would have anything to do with staying in touch and monitoring your government?

Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer. – Sun-tzu

Government is not your friend; unbridled, it can be a nightmare. And, folks want to add another layer of government in DeKalb?

Please pass the yellow mustard!

Hamburger,
I guess the effort has been on developing an algorithm to make the Opposed City look plausible rather than pay attention to the real changes in tax digest and tax rates.

Without an imaginary 'enemy' this whole ridiculous process would never have piqued the interest of the most self-serving among us.

Ms. Mesh & Minions: The same constituency that runs the BOE – School Board runs the BOC –Makes decision about Brookhaven zoning and land uses. This is only 12 percent of taxes being dedicated to our neighborhoods. The poor people of south DeKalb will still control all of the School Board and the BOC – 88 percent of our tax dollars – need not worry for them
I know you’re worried about future rezoning, do the right thing and they will pass, be a slum lord and they will not. Konas and Ko and the pillar Crowd on Brookhaven Drive will still have their separate historic enclave too! No needs to worries so much!

"Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer. – Sun-tzu"
Hamburger are you saying I got to spend more time with Eddie? Don't threaten me like that!

Seriously though, I have to work, I don't have time to constantly follow up, I have devoted a considerable portion of my life to following up with agreements and developments in DeKalb, and even if Brookhaven happens I will still have to do that since we will still be paying most of our taxes to DeKalb and getting many services from them. But at least for Police, Parks, Code Enforcement, Zoning, Development, Sidewalks, Roads and Drainage I won't have to navigate latest phone tree or pull as many teeth to get answers. Why do I say that? Because Brookhaven would be smaller with less people to find.

Bottom line, the idea of an urban county of DeKalb's size delivering county services and these municipal services is a Georgia thing and its not a good way to do things.

I shouldn't have to be an super sleuth to keep up, I shouldn't have to treat dealings with my local government as if its the Art of War.

Mr. Eric, you do not have to be a “super sleuth” to keep up with your government. If you connect with your government, you will find that most of the information you seek will come to you. If you don’t, you end up running away from your county government for the purpose of creating a city. What happens when you don’t keep up with your new city?

Special hamburger?

Ms. Mesh. It must pain you to realize that if a new City is incorporated, the code enforcement people will be more focused. But landlords that keep things up to code should not worry.
Your vitriolic posts peppered with name calling, personal attacks, conspiracy theories and character assassinations are more alarming.

Bottom line, Ms. Mesh, you have made it very clear that this "mess" that is usually called a referendum where the voters can have a DIRECT say in their future is going to be voted on. Win or lose, voters will get to vote.

You, on the other hand, seem offended because we do have the right to vote on this issue.

AGAIN--please ask your NO CITY colleagues to conduct an OPEN meeting where the whole agenda is to sell the NO CITY side to the audience. I would welcome it--and I have some Brookhaven friends that are (believe it or not) just beginning to listen to the issue for the next three weeks who would like to come. I understand there will be more meeting opportunities from the YES side...could you get that done?

Thanks in advance.

Ms. Mesh & Minions: The same constituency that runs the BOE – School Board runs the BOC –Makes decision about Brookhaven zoning and land uses. This is only 12 percent of taxes being dedicated to our neighborhoods. The poor people of south DeKalb will still control all of the School Board and the BOC – 88 percent of our tax dollars – need not worry for them
I know you’re worried about future rezoning, do the right thing and they will pass, be a slum lord and they will not. Konas and Ko and the pillar Crowd on Brookhaven Drive will still have their separate historic enclave too! No needs to worries so much!

Was this the Same meeting that the present Dist 1 member was allowed to have a voice in affairs in her dist. and the TWO members that Never asked us ,tried and Lost in their sole control of are New City.

Ms. Mesh & Minions: The same constituency that runs the BOE – School Board runs the BOC –Makes decision about Brookhaven zoning and land uses. This is only 12 percent of taxes being dedicated to our neighborhoods. The poor people of south DeKalb will still control all of the School Board and the BOC – 88 percent of our tax dollars – need not worry for them
I know you’re worried about future rezoning, do the right thing and they will pass, be a slum lord and they will not. Konas and Ko and the pillar Crowd on Brookhaven Drive will still have their separate historic enclave too! No needs to worries so much!

Ms. Mesh & Minions: The same constituency that runs the BOE – School Board runs the BOC –Makes decision about Brookhaven zoning and land uses. This is only 12 percent of taxes being dedicated to our neighborhoods. The poor people of south DeKalb will still control all of the School Board and the BOC – 88 percent of our tax dollars – need not worry for them
I know you’re worried about future rezoning, do the right thing and they will pass, be a slum lord and they will not. Konas and Ko and the pillar Crowd on Brookhaven Drive will still have their separate historic enclave too! No needs to worries so much!

Walk cars are overrrated!

Ms. Mesh & Minions: The same constituency that runs the BOE – School Board runs the BOC –Makes decision about Brookhaven zoning and land uses. This is only 12 percent of taxes being dedicated to our neighborhoods. The poor people of south DeKalb will still control all of the School Board and the BOC – 88 percent of our tax dollars – need not worry for them
I know you’re worried about future rezoning, do the right thing and they will pass, be a slum lord and they will not. Konas and Ko and the pillar Crowd on Brookhaven Drive will still have their separate historic enclave too! No needs to worries so much!

Jobs are coming to are New City Thanks to Boyer,May,Johnson,Sutton Watson had family issues the other two ,that We will Not have to bow down to were not able to keep jobs and Tax from coming to our New City.

Ms. Mesh & Minions: The same constituency that runs the BOE – School Board runs the BOC –Makes decision about Brookhaven zoning and land uses. This is only 12 percent of taxes being dedicated to our neighborhoods. The poor people of south DeKalb will still control all of the School Board and the BOC – 88 percent of our tax dollars – need not worry for them
I know you’re worried about future rezoning, do the right thing and they will pass, be a slum lord and they will not. Konas and Ko and the pillar Crowd on Brookhaven Drive will still have their separate historic enclave too! No needs to worries so much!

Ms. Mesh your demeanor and nasty name calling exemplify you group's contribution to this debate. Worthless.

You slick city lawyers with your fancy shoes!!! shakes fist. Sorry couldn't resist.

Enuff,

I have been wondering, if the Opposed City comes to pass and a municipal elections were held wouldn't a nomenclature for elected officials be in order?
Would the mayor be referred to as 'your highness' or 'poobah'?
Would the council members then be able to suffice with 'your excellency'?
If a woman would become mayor, would she be 'poobah' or 'poobette'?
At a council meeting, would there be a straight table with everyone sitting behind it (like say Chamblee used to do) or would a 'v' formation be used with the mayor in a 'clear position of reverence' as they changed the setup?
Would the mayor's birthday be a holiday when at least one serf would be freed from their transgressions?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Ms. Mesh & Minions: The same constituency that runs the BOE – School Board runs the BOC –Makes decision about Brookhaven zoning and land uses. This is only 12 percent of taxes being dedicated to our neighborhoods. The poor people of south DeKalb will still control all of the School Board and the BOC – 88 percent of our tax dollars – need not worry for them
I know you’re worried about future rezoning, do the right thing and they will pass, be a slum lord and they will not. Konas and Ko and the pillar Crowd on Brookhaven Drive will still have their separate historic enclave too! No needs to worries so much!

Thanks!

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505125_162-45040332/good-grammar-is-old-fashioned-unnecessary-and-bad-for-your-career/

Best wishes!

Also jest is a way "too's comunisicates" with the NO-sies! I mean it's not like I can stand anyone of them! Let alone wish them anything but voidness...

not much,

Well, at least the feeling is mutual!

Gracias, Calle: Duke!

Pen day oh...

No properties should have increased one iota! They are still tanking! I don't care what side your on: yes/no hamburger/portabella...

http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/news/2012/05/29/spcase-shiller-atlanta-home-prices.html

one, you need to contact this fellow. He can assist you with appealing your property taxes. He sent his mailer to the northern part of 30319. Tell him Mr. HamBurger sent you!

http://atlantaappeals.com/

Please pass the yellow mustard!

I don't pay taxes only the little people do, you should really talk to MEI about that, I's gots me some foundations! For realz!

You probably need like a job or something.

MazdOnly

HA HA HA. LOL! I know you need an education...maybe a DEADkab GED!