After hearing so much from Rep. [Mike] Jacobs and the [Brookhaven Yes/Citizens for North DeKalb] Committee about how the proposed City of Brookhaven police department will be wonderful simply because it will mimic the Dunwoody police model, I felt it was time to look deeper into the department that is to be replicated. And, quite frankly, what I have found is quite unsettling. It seems the Dunwoody Police Department looked great on paper when the city was promoting its start-up budget. Now, just three short years later, the bare bones budget police department is beginning to see real problems resulting directly from its limited staffing.
The 2012 budget report for the City of Dunwoody includes a “Challenges” section that begins with “Dunwoody faces several challenges that have a significant impact on our efforts to maintain our current service levels” and continues “…With a force of just 46 sworn officers, it is growing increasingly difficult to maintain adequate visibility and reduce crime….an aging inventory of apartments poses a significant challenge to a small police department”. This from a city who’s 2 or 3 apartments pale in comparison to the dozen or more run down, crime infested, gunshot riddled apartments along miles of Buford Highway in the proposed City of Brookhaven.
A report by Dunwoody Chief of Police Billy Grogan, presented to the Mayor and Council in January 2012, includes the following: “Based on our existing staffing level, our officers are asked to be more productive, respond to more incidents, and address more crime incidents than their counterparts in virtually all of our surrounding and similar cities.” Chief Grogan continues with “…I am concerned about the long term effects of the high workload”. “…the high workload will deteriorate staff morale, increase turnover rates, increase staff fatigue, reduce officer safety, limit work production, decrease community interaction and result in incomplete investigations”. In conclusion, the reports describe an understaffed, overworked Dunwoody police force that is simply responding to crimes, not preventing crimes.
The current Dunwoody police model includes a force of 0.99 sworn officers per 1,000 citizens. This officer ratio is considered by Chief Grogan to be severely inadequate for the level of services it is asked to provide. In his report, Chief Grogan request a “minimum staffing increase” of 16 officers, a 35% increase over current staffing, to provide what he believes will approach an adequate police force for the City of Dunwoody.
The Grogan report further states “an adequate staffing ratio for our department is 1.56 officers per 1,000 citizens”. In other words, the Chief of Police for the City of Dunwoody, the exemplary model for which the proposed City of Brookhaven police force is based, believes his police force is understaffed by 50%. Is this really the police model we want to mimic for the proposed City of Brookhaven?
The Grogan report also compares the police force of seven similar sized cities in metro Atlanta and found the average size to be 2.06 officers for each 1,000 citizens. DeKalb County, the police force we have been told by Rep. Jacobs and the committee is severely understaffed and not capable of providing sufficient officers to patrol the proposed City of Brookhaven, has a staff of 2.26 sworn police officers per 1,000 citizens in unincorporated DeKalb – over two times both the existing Dunwoody police force and the proposed City of Brookhaven police force.
The budget for the police force for the proposed City of Brookhaven found in Rep Jacobs feasibility study includes 53 officers or 1.08 officers for each 1,000 citizens. An officer count that while very similar to the “understaffed and overworked” Dunwoody police force is nearly one half the size of the average police force in seven similar cities in metro Atlanta and over 50% smaller than the current DeKalb County police force.
Whether you use the Dunwoody adequate staffing police model; or the seven city average police model; or the DeKalb County police model, the police force for the proposed City of Brookhaven should have 76 or 102 or 111 total police officers respectively. Regardless of the model, the reality is that of the 105 officers in the Dekalb County Police North Precinct, 80 percent of the staff or 84 officers are routinely assigned to the proposed City of Brookhaven “footprint” to respond to crimes in the area, particularly along the Buford Highway corridor. Clearly, based on the real life examples we see in Dunwoody and the proposed City of Brookhaven, the hypothetical Rep. Jacobs' police force for the proposed City of Brookhaven is woefully understaffed.
Unfortunately, with a higher officer count comes a higher budget which of course is more difficult to sell when you’re trying to ram through a bill for a new city. Using the numbers for police services and police start-up found in Rep Jacobs’ feasibility study, the additional 23 officers required to provide Chief Grogan’s adequate staffing ratio of 1.56 officers per 1,000 citizens (76 total officers) for the proposed City of Brookhaven police force would add $2,777,250 to a budget that currently has less than $200,000 to spare.
While I understand the premise for the proposed City of Brookhaven is to do more with less, I for one, am not comfortable risking the safety of my family and my neighbors to an understaffed police force model that is clearly showing signs of severe stress in our “peer” city to the north. After closer review, I believe that the police force for the proposed City of Brookhaven was devised not to protect the citizens of the proposed city, but instead it was devised to protect the marketability of a feasibility study that contains artificially low budget numbers for critical services in the proposed city.
While the police model proposed in Rep. Jacobs' feasibility study may be budget friendly in the short term, we need only to look to Dunwoody, our much touted “peer” city to the north, to see that his unrealistically low assumptions for police services will very soon lead to an unsustainable public safety budget that puts us all at great risk.
Before we are asked to vote on this issue, sufficient time must be spent to look beyond the pages of Rep. Jacobs hypothetical feasibility study and apply real-life examples to the budget for the services that are critically needed to serve the long term needs of the citizens of the proposed City of Brookhaven.
Jonathan
7:18 pm on Thursday, February 9, 2012
Interesting.... The most outspoken opponent writes an article against the city. Here is a fact, we can take the overage from the parks budget and hire 16 extra officers on top of the current estimate. Is it clean? No. But it can work out.
Citizen
7:53 pm on Thursday, February 9, 2012
People don't relate to the real truth. Do an open records act on the police dispatch records and see how many house checks and business checks Dekalb pd has done in the Brookhaven area. Dekalb Officers are all in the really bad areas and hold calls for 45 minutes to an hour in the busy hours. Now that Brookhaven is going to be voted on you will see more Dekalb Officers in the area because they have assigned them to stay there until the vote. Then if Brookhaven does not become a city the officers will be back in the highest crime areas of Dekalb. Look at the Dekalb Officers Blog they can't keep good officers and treat them horribly. Dekalb PD is always in the news with there officers being arrested. Is that the type officer you want responding to your home?
don Gabacho
9:36 pm on Thursday, February 9, 2012
"Look at the Dekalb Officers Blog they can't keep good officers and treat them horribly. Dekalb PD is always in the news with there officers being arrested. Is that the type officer you want responding to your home?"
The DeKalb County police have the same problem that most of the area's and even nation's police. They must stop hiring themselves out, in uniform or out, to bars, restaurants, convenience stores, etc. and dissolve their "Hispanic-liason divisions" for the same good reason: "Equal Protection of the Law."
Meanwhile, it sure beats Doraville's police.
don Gabacho
9:43 pm on Thursday, February 9, 2012
Whoops. Cities, counties, states anywhere and the federal government must also stop hiring police---or anyone holding a position of the "public trust"---having dual citizenship whether sought or conferred.
Frustrated Incorporated
12:23 am on Sunday, February 12, 2012
If Ashford incorporates, you don't think that the police resources will be dispatched and dedicated to the so called "Bad Areas" as in Buford Hwy? Where paople are robbed and shot (sometimes hit) frequently? Violent crimes (crimes against persons) always takes priority over property crimes. So when/if Ashford or Brookhaven, North Atlanta incorporates you will see that your police department isn't doing patrol in Hampton Hall, but responding to violent crimes on Buford Hwy. Imagine that.
Enuff Govt Already
9:00 am on Monday, February 13, 2012
I asked an officer; it took a couple of days for the officer to respond back but the officer said according to their electronic patrol log book in 2011 the north precinct conducted approximately 26,000 house and business checks, approximately 15,000 other requested patrols, worked over 164,000 service calls, gave out over 33,000 tickets and made over 6,600 arrest. Hope it helps:)
Resident 30319
8:32 pm on Thursday, February 9, 2012
Jim Eyre conveniently fails to mention that Dunwoody Chief Grogan's request of 18 additional officers is over a 5 year period. Only 4 officers are being requested for 2013 a full 4 years after incorporation. Using Eyre's model; 4 additional officers might be needed in Ashford by the year 2017.
Jim Eyre
2:17 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
actually, he did request all this year but went on to say he realized that, with other budget concerns facing the city of Dunwoody, he would not get the total number requested so he spread it out over 5 years...he then reiterated that adequate staffing for his force today was 1.56 officers/1000 citizens..50% more than he currently has on staff.
Resident 30319
2:59 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
There is no mention in Chief Grogan's report of requesting the additional staffing in one year. The report is clear that this is a five year request.
William
3:12 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
FACT CHECK
http://jkheneghan.com/city/meetings/2012/Jan/Retreat/Police%20Manpower%20Discussion%20Council%20Retreat.pdf
Here is Chief Grogan's memo to the City Council.
Quotes:
"any change will take time to address and potentially many years to fully implement."
"I believe there are several functional areas we should consider augmenting over the next few years."
"My hope is that with these different functional areas in mind the City Council can agree on our staffing needs and develop a long-term plan to fund those needs over the coming years."
He then went on to request 4 new officers in 2013!!! Not 'this year.'
Oh...those 4 officers are the CRT ("Crime Response Team") and are being requested in 2013. They would not have an impact on budget because they are mainly a traffic response/ticketing unit. Again, from the memo...They would "conduct directed traffic enforcement targeting areas of complaint as well as areas with high incidents of accidents."
Here is the money quote from the memo: "this unit would have a net zero impact on the budget." Why? Because traffic enforcement nets tickets.
If you are really interested in police in Dunwoody, there is plenty of information that is up to date and informative and ACCURATE on the Dunwoody website and on John Henegen's blog.
Bill Lowe
3:53 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
Common Sense Check:
He did not ask for them to be implemented immediately because he already knew there was not enough money to hire the officers immediately, otherwise they would have been hired last year.
Hiring officers whose sole job is to pay for their own salary via traffic citations is the quickest path to a city like Doraville. From what I understand, this is already going on in Dunwoody and they are not impartial to who they give tickets to. Just be aware that if you are an active promoter of this future city that you never complain about the police doing their job to finance their own employment when you are stopped and issued a ticket whether guilty or innocent. The time is coming where people will put cameras with DVR's in their own cars to protect themselves against this sort of crap.
The easiest option is to avoid the situation completely.
I'm still waiting on someone to really defend and sell me on the whole inclusion of Buford Highway as a benefit to the new city. Actually, just sell me on why a new police force would be better than keeping DeKalb police in the new city. Providing Police services is not a requirement for a new city. Only three former county services are required. You could outsource the trash collection, run parks and recreation, and zoning and land use for relatively small amounts of money.....Or is that not enough money to make it worth while?
Laurenthia Mesh
9:28 am on Friday, February 10, 2012
DeKalb County North Precinct Police lowered crime 30%. They deserve praise. If you believe these nay-sayers, then our Police did it with one arm tied behind their back!
Elizabeth F
11:53 am on Friday, February 10, 2012
Great article! Thanks so much for doing this research.
Resident2 30319
3:36 pm on Friday, February 10, 2012
Mesh... can you provide data to that claim? Im on the fence so be careful with your answer.
William
4:56 pm on Friday, February 10, 2012
The last set of statistics the county has online is from November 2011 which showed a 9.5% decrease in violent crime in the county and a 1.6% decrease in property crime from the same point in 2011. DeKalb has not released, to my knowledge, any statistics after 11/2011 and does not break down statistics by Precinct for public consumption. (at least not anywhere online other than the limited historical data on the crimetrac mapping site) Also, there is a pretty significant caveat on the site that looks like these aren't even the actual numbers that are reported.
http://web.co.dekalb.ga.us/DK_Police/pdf/2011_11_monthly_crime_statistics.pdf
For comparison's sake, Dunwoody despite their 'woe,' as the author would call it, was down 14.4% in violent crime and down .9% in property crime in 2011 (Dec. included).
http://dunwoodyga.gov/departments/Dunwoody-Police-Department/About-Dunwoody-PD/Crime_Comparison.aspx
No one questions the devotion of the men and women that serve and protect. I certainly question the resources they are given by the county and the sheer volume they are asked to patrol...but that doesn't affect their desire to protect. However, the facts are the facts.
Enuff Govt Already
8:52 am on Saturday, February 11, 2012
The north precinct year end criminal analysis report had violent crime down 27% and property crime down 16%. The report also said the total number of arrest were up 20% and some sub categories: DUI arrest up 26% and felony arrest up 8%. The report also said 911 dispatch calls were up 12% for the year.
Public safety is my number 1 issue. I've spent some time researching this on line, calling the precinct and taking every oportunity I can to speak with officers. The officers have been great and a wonderful source of information.
What has been proposed for the new city is a definate dangerous downgrade in police services. These new cities are now hitting their revenue wall. At some point in the near future I expect Dunwoody's council will stop giving the bobblehead response to their police chief and start asking some tough questions. Their own financial forecast has the city spending more than it takes in starting next year. Then they get hit with a $1.8 million request from the chief who said he wants to offer enhanced police services that were previouly offered by the county police. Dunwoody police consumed close to 30% of their city budget while only posting a 1% decrease in crime. Then the implied threat of officer attrition, low morale and declining productivity as the caveat for his funding increase should be a huge red flag for proponents of a new city.
Enuff Govt Already
8:53 am on Saturday, February 11, 2012
I also asked some county police officers about being redeployed to other areas of the county. The officers I spoke with said that would only happen in the rarest of circumstances like a natural disaster, riot or extreme emergency. They said most of the time additional officers from other specialized sections of the police department are in the precincts adding to total number of officers working.
I also asked about the police blog and got a rather salty response. One officer said that while small kernals of truth can sometimes be found there he would describe most of the comments as scribbles on the walls of the 9th grade bathroom wall. I asked about their training. They said they receive over 1000 hours before they graduate the academy. The academy was described as para military with an emphasis on reality based senario based training. They said most other small departments either send officers to a state academy that only provides about 400 hours of training or the department has a mixed bag of officers trained by different academies. It was described as a quality control problem for smaller police departments.
Enuff Govt Already
8:54 am on Saturday, February 11, 2012
The county budget book for 2010 also reported an interesting nugget of information. It said in 2010 the county police cleared 67% of serious crimes while the national average is only 31%.
Downgrading police services to a city of (insert yet to be determined name here) is just dangerous and dumb. Again re-introduce the township initiative. It would satisfy most of the C4ND's desires and leave the expensive public works and public safety to the county. ........sorry the post showed up back ward, oops
Laurenthia Mesh
11:33 pm on Friday, February 10, 2012
I'm happy to give the reference. The number is in the brochure Major Logan distributed at the Montgomery School Meeting and handed to Rep. Mike Jacobs saying, "Somebody gave the Carl Vinson Institute the wrong numbers. I'm not saying it was you, Rep. Jacobs, but somebody gave them the wrong numbers."
Our North DeKalb Precinct lowered crime in our area 30%.
Stop insulting our Police and our County. We happen to like it here.
don Gabacho
12:16 pm on Friday, February 17, 2012
Attributing the popular quote in D.C. to the factitious ancient Roman, Petronius Arbiter:
"I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it could be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency and demoralization." ---Arthur A. Clarke; "Your Government Failed You"
Bill Lowe
12:55 am on Saturday, February 11, 2012
Here is something interesting to consider. None of the cities mentioned have a Buford Highway to contend with. It is simply moronic to have any part of Buford Highway attached to such a prestigious area such as Brookhaven simply for the tax income to fund a city. If your goal to include Buford Highway was for more noble purposes, such as to clean up the problem areas and rename it to something more fru fru like Chandelier Parkway. DeKalb police will be glad to have those numbers off of their books. I can assure you of that. Crime in unincorporated DeKalb County will decrease significantly once Brookhaven has policing control over Buford Highway. Keep an eye on your statistics for crime. It will be eye opening. Hopefully, the new city will be able to hire some of DeKalb's officers that once worked Buford Highway, if the city is able to afford them. They might find better pay at Stone Mountain Park if you are under budget constraints or if you can cut back on parks spending and a city hall and a police station, and road maintenance equipment and supplies and whatever else a new government entity needs to buy and spend to get itself going.
Don't worry, I live just outside of the boundaries and cannot vote for or against the city. I do like to watch car crashes, and train wrecks, and other disasters. I just can't look away when I see it coming.
don Gabacho
3:54 am on Saturday, February 11, 2012
"It is simply moronic to have any part of Buford Highway attached to such a prestigious area such as Brookhaven simply for the tax income to fund a city."
"Tax income" is not even the major reason for it.
"If...noble purposes."
Please, not even close.
"...once Brookhaven has policing control over Buford Highway ...hire some of DeKalb's officers that once worked Buford Highway,..."
Good grief!
City or no new city, until the Mexican Consulate and its allied Latino governments' consulates are removed from our county and State, and get them off everyone's backs, including the illegals and *any* police, you might as well be whistling Dixie.
BH Resident
10:10 am on Saturday, February 11, 2012
I can’t believe the double standard. Jim Erye provides some very thorough, well researched and objective commentary on the tax and services issues and all of the city supporters call it false and self-serving. But Stan Segal gets up in a Brookhaven Yes meeting and says he supports a new city because he will be able to control his own taxes and then goes on to say that he hasn’t looked at the numbers because when he does, his eyes glaze over. Are you kidding me? And this is the reason we should blindly follow the proponents of cityhood. You are being propagandized by Jacob’s private agenda and are so drunk with the prospect of power you can’t even see straight. Wake up people
Mike Jacobs
11:32 am on Saturday, February 11, 2012
There isn't a double standard. Mr. Eyre is making a commentary that is not merely objective. If you agree with him, that's okay. However:
The 80% DeKalb County police staffing number comes from the fact that four of the five zones that make up the North Precinct contain a portion of the proposed city's footprint. However, one of those zones is only two-thirds in the footprint and another zone is less than 10% in the footprint. DeKalb could also say that they assign every sworn officer in the entire DeKalb PD to the proposed city, but that doesn't make it so. The proposed city is only about 50% of the North Precinct.
Dunwoody has many more than 2 or 3 apartment complexes. In fact, it has more apartment units than single family residences. It also has areas that are demographically identical to Buford Highway.
The Grogan memo that Mr. Eyre cites actually concerns Dunwoody's future projected police needs, not current levels.
Nobody has focused solely on Dunwoody as a model for policing Brookhaven. I have talked about Dunwoody to show that the overall CVI estimates are accurate and conservative. The CVI study uses Smyrna and Johns Creek in addition to Dunwoody to arrive at an estimated police expenditure amount.
The CVI study is not a city budget. It is an estimate of revenues and expenditures. The city council that you elect -- in the General Election of a presidential election year with the highest voter turnout -- will make the actual budget decisions.
don Gabacho
12:14 pm on Saturday, February 11, 2012
Yet again! Yet again you must be asked "What are you doing about---and have ever done about---"officials and employees of the Mexican Government registering voters for our elections"?
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Enuff Govt Already
6:44 pm on Saturday, February 11, 2012
In the Grogan memo he stated that he was concerned about services his department "does not offer". Those police services were previously provided by the county police. They are showing the strains of trying to provide the police services needed in a large metro area with a small limited service department. The idea that a new city would try to police this area with a similar approach is disturbing. I can't recall a murder on Ashford Dunwoody Road in Dunwoody prior to their incorporation nor can I recall a double murder of prominate citizens going dormant prior to incorporation. For 2011 the DeKalb north precinct produced double digit drops in crime while absorbing an increase in dispatched calls. The DeKalb chief spoke at the state capitol about the enhanced services they provide that played a roll in the drop in crime. A new city would not provide any enhanced serivces. The county does public safety right and far more economical than a city. Down grading police services is wrong.
Slow It Down
4:52 pm on Sunday, February 12, 2012
Rep. Jacobs, could you please clarify exactly which areas (street names) of Dunwoody are "demographically identical to Buford Highway"?
Thanks.
don Gabacho
4:16 pm on Saturday, February 18, 2012
"There isn't a double standard."
Just for the record Mr. Jacobs: From which of your two faces did that come from?
Bill Lowe
1:32 pm on Saturday, February 11, 2012
Mike Jacobs:
There is no comparable area to Buford Highway in any of these cities. There might be some low rent apartments scattered about, but no 3 mile stretch of them.
Do not pass off this issue on the elected officials to run the future city to do the right thing. This is your ball, and you will be held ultimately responsible for the success or failure of your venture. Those that elect are generally sheep, and you are their herder. They follow blindly, and listen to and believe what you say. If you lead them to slaughter with the idea there is food if they keep walking over a cliff, they will do it. Because you are their leader. I know you cannot guarrantee success with this, nor should you. You should at least offer up an exit strategy in your bill if that is possible to do. I know it is easier to create government than it is to get rid of it....and an exit strategy might be wise to incorporate into the bill. If things get tough in the policing aspect, drop that problem area from your city. Sure, you will lose income, but it is a winning move. It is going to be tough policing the Northern area(Murphy Candler) as well as the Southern area(Buford Highway). We will ignore the middle because the police traffic will be speeding back and forth up and down Dresden---the Sebring Speedway for Police(tm).
Your city council districts also need a little revising, cause it is a little too North-heavy---which is not democratic in any way.
Frustrated Incorporated
12:15 am on Monday, February 13, 2012
Buford Hwy as an economic generator is not a safe bet. It is driven by an imigrant population that is effected by the economy and imigration legislation. Maybe the folks from Murphy Candler and Hampton Hall should drive down to Buford Hwy to check out the businesses that will sustain a Ashford or Brookhaven.
Bill Lowe
5:35 am on Monday, February 13, 2012
One of the promoters of the city stated that Buford Highway was included not only for the tax base for income purposes, but because DeKalb county code enforcement was not doing anything about all of those run down apartments and the new city wants to clean it up. I am not sure they know what cleaning it up will do. It will destroy all of the businesses in that area, thus making the problem worse not only for that area, but also for the city income---but that is not why they really want that area, they want to include it in the new city not only for the tax base but also to clean it up. I am in a loop and skipping. Please bump the turntable.
don Gabacho
3:02 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
If serious, get a foundation on the "loop," Do an internet search on "corporatism" in government including the Mexican Government's (though there will be little to find on Mexico's per se given recent scourings).
In a few days, we can pick,up on the tread here.
don Gabacho
4:12 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
William,
Will you clarify your "Fact Check"?
"Oh...those 4 officers are the CRT ('Crime Response Team')...they would not have an impact on budget because they are mainly a traffic response/ticketing...They would "conduct directed traffic enforcement targeting areas of complaint as well as areas with high incidents of accidents."
Is that what Dunwoody's "Criminal Response Team" does?
And the expense of four whenever, additional officers to be offset by that many more officers of the "Criminal Response Team" being assigned to 'enforcing traffic laws'?
Your "Fact Check" has it appear that Dunwoody's "Criminal Response Team" depends on its officers being misassigned and the department itself dedicated, and dependent, now or in the future, on Dunwoody being a virtual speed trap.
Is that the "fact" of your "Fact Check"?
don Gabacho
5:06 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
"I'm convinced the advocates of the new city at least base their comments on facts, and not fabrications."
"Facts" are only as valid as to what they are applied. William has just now related how "the facts" of Dunwoody should apply to a new, if any, city.
Despite there having to be something terribly wrong with any city that has made it, or must make it, its policy to hire police for "criminal response" perform a separate duty instead, much less a duty, in the performance of which, guarantees there own salaries.
Doesn't it strike you that Dunwoody may simply require fewer "criminal responders," at the higher cost those salaries must be, by simply having hired more "traffic enforcers" to begin with?
Whatever "the facts" applied to such a scenario as Dunwoody's, shouldn't it convince anyone that Dunwoody has problems not to be emulated, much less held model?
If anything, these proponents of this new city, if sincere in their civic-mindedness, should be applying "the facts" to cleaning up Dunwoody's problems rather than make Dunwoody's problems the same problems for anyone else.
Enuff Govt Already
5:09 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
Guess nobody paid attention to the financial forecast presented by their city showing they will be spending more than they taken in starting in 2013. Their major expense; public safety. What we need to do is pull HB636 and start over with a township legislation. A small city will not be able to adequately provide police and public work. Downgrading public safety is just dangerous and dumb.
And some unintended consequences; a bill was filed to create a city of DeKalb. Rep Jacobs said he appreciates what Rep Mitchell is trying to do but that he has to oppose it. He called on delegation members to proceed very cautiously. Rep. Taylor is quoted as saying there would be a duplication of services . "There are all those services that the county provides to the cities." he said.
Mike Jacobs
5:33 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
I've supported township legislation in the past and know from experience that there is not 2/3 of the House and 2/3 of the Senate to support the constitutional amendment required to give zoning power to a third type of local government (other than counties and cities).
Unlike a city, a township is double taxation. You would pay the township for planning, zoning, and code enforcement and continue paying the county for those same services.
The answer to all of the hair-splitting over police services is this: $25.1 million (the CVI expenditure estimate) is more than enough to run a successful city.
The actual expenditure decisions will be made by the city council that you elect.
Enuff Govt Already
6:37 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
Previously there wasn't 2/3 support for the creation of cities or the abolishment of the 3 mile rule. Why not re-write itthe township initiative to fix the issues. I believe a small city is a double taxation because in our environment they can't and don't provide all the needed services; especially public safety and public works. Ask Chamblee who they have IGAs with for public works they can't perform. Who do they have an IGA with for enhanced police services like SWAT. Didn't they called the county to work a child murder a few years ago? Under HB636 all the money in the police services tax district would go to a new city. That means the county will not provide any police services, no dispatching, no extra manpower when needed, no enhanced services like SWAT or specialized detectives. The list could go on. Downgrading our public safety is dangerous and dumb!
don Gabacho
5:51 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
Mr Jacobs:
5:50 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
5:33 pm on Saturday, February 11, 2012
Mr. Jacobs, Just as obvious as the US Constitution not empowering any foreign power to involve itself in our elections is, so is the U.S. Constitution not a "personal attack":
"Article. VI.
...This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.
The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution..."
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12:09 pm on Sunday, February 12, 2012
Yet again: "All Contributions appreciated. Corporate and personal contributions are accepted.'? For what? At a 'Pub' no less?"
Obviously, this solicitation can be construed to be an additional price for public service already paid.
Or, even, the price to protect from public service already paid.
don Gabacho
7:19 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
Mr Jacobs:
Word (692 K) - Secretaría de Relaciones Exteriores
portal.sre.gob.mx/atlanta/pdf/NC12nov07.doc
12 Nov 2007 – Consulado General de México en Atlanta ...
Mesa Directiva del Instituto de México, Charlotte Carral, y
el Coordinador de eventos del ... minutos antes de terminar
el programa, agradeció a nombre del Gobierno de México, los
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http://bit.ly/nkqBuS
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Word (692 K) - Secretaría de Relaciones Exteriores
portal.sre.gob.mx/atlanta/pdf/NC12nov07.doc
12 Nov 2007 – Consulado General de México en Atlanta ...
Mesa Directiva del Instituto de México, Charlotte Carral, y
el Coordinador de eventos del ... minutos antes de terminar
el programa, agradeció a nombre del Gobierno de México, los
Consulado General de México en Atlanta
portal.sre.gob.mx/atlanta/index.php?option...
20 Nov 2007 – Visa para México: Cambios importantes, click
Directiva del Instituto de México, Charlotte
Carral, y el Coordinador de eventos del ... de terminar el
programa, agradeció a nombre del Gobierno de México, los
esfuerzos ...[DOC]
Word (692 K) - Secretaría de Relaciones Exteriores
portal.sre.gob.mx/atlanta/pdf/NC12nov07.doc
Laurenthia Mesh
8:08 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
resident 30319
No one responds to anonymous slanderers. Please state your name so I may respond.
don Gabacho
10:16 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012
Chip, Even if you don't understand, as I'm sure you don't, what I just posted, I do believe its at the point that it really doesn't matter what Jacobs says or does with 'most anyone' anymore on any matter of government.,.
Like most any politician, its the issue they avoid that tells. No?
Jodi Cobb
8:01 am on Saturday, February 18, 2012
GENERATING INCOME FOR A CITY - PART DEUX
Now anyone that knows me knows I am all about our good men and women in uniform. I have worked closely with the North Precinct as past President of Drew Valley for 4 years. I had Chief O’Brien and his team speak at our general meeting. Invited our beat cops to our block parties. I had the personal cell phone number of our ICP officer and used it for incidences in Drew Valley often. I am all about public safety, but in the interest of generating income for the new city with a smaller force everyone should make sure their taillights and headlights are in working order, that they stop a full 5 seconds at all stop signs, USE THEIR BLINKERS (a personal pet peeve of mine) and don’t speed! or this gray haired woman will shake her finger at you as you speed by. You can be guaranteed people driving in the new city will be getting citations on a regular basis because we will most assuredly need more than 53 cops in the new city and they will have to pay for them somehow. Talk to residents of Pine Lake, famous for their vehicle citations.
Of course, this may be irrelevant because those 53 officers will be focused on Buford Hwy crime and may not have time for traffic tickets.
Jodi Cobb
8:04 am on Saturday, February 18, 2012
GENERATING INCOME FOR A CITY
My mother lived in in Dunwoody for 36 years. Her last 6 months were spent bedridden in her home. She passed away at 11pm on July 3, 2011 and by the time the funeral home left it was 2am before I could drive home. I had stopped at the light in the right hand lane on Chamblee Dunwoody at 285 when I saw a car pull up on my left a bit behind me. The light changed and as I start to go the blue lights come on. Now mind you, I am a gray haired woman in a Prius with a Ga Tech license plate and Ga Tech Alumni license plate surround, having done nothing wrong.
I pull into the gas station a second set of blue lights is pulling in. I roll down my window, I am crying and ask "What did I do?" Meanwhile, the other officer is peering in my passenger window with his flashlight shining down on my laundry basket full of clean clothes, as I had been basically living at my mom's for weeks. I was obviously distraught and told the officer my mother had just died holding up the funeral home papers. He proceeds to tell me I have a tail light out. A TAIL LIGHT OUT? I am pulled over at 2am by 2 cars with blue lights flashing because of a taillight out? At that point the nice young officer asked where I lived and if I was alright to get home. I told him I was and they let me go on my way. I believe if my mother had not just died I would have been given a citation for my taillight being out. I feel sure they were hoping there would be more considering it was 2am.
~C
1:30 pm on Saturday, February 18, 2012
1-Brookhaven's police force estimation was NOT based on Dunwoody numbers, it was based on a mix of this city and others to include Smyrna etc etc. Come on folks, read the report.
Vote in July and have your say.
~C
Bill Lowe
4:21 pm on Saturday, February 18, 2012
The other night at the Oglethorpe meeting I brought up the city of Chamblee, the size, and city population, and the number of sworn officers. I don't think they liked that much. Just for comparison: Chamblee is about 6 square miles, has a population of 16,000 and 53 sworn officers---they also run and maintain a jail--which Brookhaven won't do. The CVI study for the city of Brookhaven says: 12 square miles, population of 49,000, 54 sworn officers. Let's see: Twice as much area, Three times as many people, one more officer. His response was essentially---The CVI study is not set in stone. It is a guide. The city council and the mayor will set the actual budget and decide what is really needed. Me thinks a pseudo city council should be formed before the vote to determine what is really needed, to give actual numbers before a city is actually created, rather than leaving it in limbo land. Many people have bought into the better services, better parks, better policing, better zoning. Well, you don't often get anything better than what you have already got without paying a premium for it. Are the future residents of the new city ready to pay a premium or are they going to be upset when a premium is forced on them? I know if I am annexed into Chamblee I will more than likely be paying a premium for that. Chamblee has been around for what? Over a 100 years? I know what I am getting without any surprises. Can future city residents claim no surprises?
Bill Lowe
4:24 pm on Saturday, February 18, 2012
City of Chamblee budget is a little less than 15 million. Brookhaven/Ashford proposed budget is 25 million. I do hope that the voting public knows what they are doing, unless they are planning on moving sometime soon or are underwater on their houses and have nothing to lose by walking away.