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Do You Support The Charter Schools Amendment?

On Nov. 6, voters will decide if the state of Georgia can create charter schools, or will those decisions remain at the local levels.

 


In less than two weeks, voters will decide if Georgia can create a state commission authorizing charter schools.

The issue has stirred controversy all across metro Atlanta. Some Democratic leaders are calling the ballot biased and misleading. Others, however, are reaching across political aisles to support the amendment. On Saturday, Oct. 27, two state lawmakers - one Republican, the other a Democrat - are headlining a rally in support of the amendment.

State Sen. Jason Carter, who represents some of Decatur under the Gold Dome, is outspoken in his opposition to the measure.

Some parents who support charter schools are running into opposition in their respective PTAs. One DeKalb County mom said national PTA leaders support charter schools, but is frustrated by Georgia PTA's opposition to them.

So our question to you is: do you support charter schools? Should Georgia be allowed to create a commission authorizing them, or should these decisions remain at the local school-board level?

Related items:

Voters Sue Over 'Misleading' Charter School Ballot Language


Leaders Debate Charter School Amendment in North Fulton

Charter School Amendment: The Truth About Georgia HR 1162.

Senate Dems Criticize Latest Charter School Manuevering.

Sen. Chip Rogers And Rep. Alisha Morgan To Speak At Charter Schools WORK Rally.

State Sen. Jason Carter Opposes Charter School Amendment.

Opinion: Rescind Opposition To Charter School Amendment.

  • Will you vote for or against Georgia's charter schools amendment?

    (Voting has been closed for this question)
    • For. We need more charter schools authorized at the state level.
        30 (36%)
    • Against. These decisions are better made at the local level.
        50 (60%)
    • I don't know.
        2 (2%)
    • I don't care. I don't have kids.
        1 (1%)
    Total votes: 83
  • Your vote will only count once. This is not a scientific poll. View Results Vote!
Related Topics: Charter Schools and Question Of The Week

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Jonathan Cribbs

5:45 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

I've still got some reading to do before I decide how to vote on this. I've read plenty of politicians' opinions, but nothing that's gone into a sufficient amount of detail.

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Mike Gambino

10:51 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Kids First - Union's Last. Vote yes!

Jack Sartain

8:01 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

ANYTHING to improve the educational results for our children. What we have today, overall, is NOT GETTING IT DONE. LOOK AT GRADUATION RATES, TEST SCORES, etc ......THE PROOF OF THE PUDDING IN IN THE EATING THEREOF!

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Eddie E.

8:02 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Each educational dollar can only be spent once (unless by some miracle our State Government does the right thing and raise revenues enough to adequately fund education).
Therefore, giving state money to an ill-advised, unproven, unaccountable educational gimmick is just 'stealing' that same money from the existing, approved educational funding structure.
It really is that simple!

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Button

3:15 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Why do you believe Charter schools are a gimmick?

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Eddie E.

4:35 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

What evidence is there for a common plan to improve educational outcomes?
What requirements for effective, sustained improvement are required to attain and continue access to TAXPAYER funds by for-profit companies?
Why does the state funding that 'follows a student' into a school have a possibility to 'stay with the school' if the student leaves?
For starters.
I don't have a problem with REAL, local school board approved charters that have the same requirement for accepting ALL students as with other publicly funded schools. Beyond that if parents want their children to attend schools that do not have the same open enrollment requirements, there are already numerous other 'choices' available.

Tax money is hard to come by and throwing giant piles of it into undefined, unproven schemes is not an appropriate use.

But, we could always raise the necessary revenue to reduce class sizes (and hire the necessary additional teacher) which has substantial research proving an improved outcome.

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Button

11:57 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

Your arguments are very much centered on money allocation. Should we not be more focused on giving our children the best chance they can to succeed? They are the ones who will carry the debt we have now. You can insult charter schools all you want but these "unproven, ill-advised" schools are allowing teachers the room to educate their students in new and creative ways. Allowing them to not just teach to a test stifling any chance for a child to fall in love with learning. As a new teacher myself I was originally extremely excited to educate our youth but class sizes are to large, I am limited to what I can teach and how I should teach it. All my ideas crushed. Im not against public school but I think there should be major improvements. So...

"Shall the Constitution of Georgia be amended to allow state or local approval of public charter schools upon the request of local communities?"

If the community feels there public schools are not doing there children justice educationally, they should have to right to request other options and the government should support this.

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Eddie E.

2:16 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Button,
'Money allocation' is and always be the center of this argument.
Slow but consistent reduction in available education funding from the State (generated from state revenue sources) coupled with the housing boom/bust (squeezing property tax revenue from each county for schools) has squeezed ALL Public School systems. This is the simple reality and should be obvious to everyone.
However, we could concentrate on adequate funding, class size reduction and modification to teacher's compensation FIRST.
You state yourself the level of frustration created by the excessively large classes (and although you didn't state it, I'm sure the lack of adequate para-pro assistance doesn't help either).
This was not supposed to be the case. We were on the path to reduce class sizes and provide adequate assistance to larger classes UNTIL 2003 when the new governor decided it would be too expensive. The disasters that have followed over the decade demonstrate the short sighted nature of that ill-advised funding cut.
Yet I remain convinced that starting over with unproven concepts designed primarily to ensure shareholder profits are NOT the proper path.

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Button

11:11 pm on Monday, October 29, 2012

Classroom sizes is just a shallow frustration in a pool deep with problems and we cant even fix that. There is no incentive to progressively rectify these issues because most families only have one option for their child's education. So why bother if they have to enroll their student there anyway.

Maybe a little competition from board approved charter schools will be the motivation needed to kickstart some much needed changes in public schools.

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Monty Brewster

11:41 pm on Monday, October 29, 2012

Button, class size is increasing because funding is decreasing. If parents would band together and approach their delegates about this, we could do something. But the corporations seem to have more reasoning (AKA campaign donations).

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Mike Gambino

10:31 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

The only problem is that the system you speak of is failing and lack of money is not the issue.

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Monty Brewster

4:13 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Lack of funding and decreasing funding surely isn't going to help. Maybe we should tell our legislators to free up all schools from all the red tape is it is working so well at charter schools. Why is this not brought up? Conservatives wanting to spend more money on schools that will need more government to watch over it? HOW IS THAT CONSERVATIVE? That is the most Liberal nonsense I've ever heard of... and even going as far as to change the CONSTITUTION to do so! Welcome to the United States of Entitlement.

Sally

8:03 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Probably will vote for it. Anything to get control away from the Dekalb County Board of Education. BTW, simply calling it giving control to the state is a talking point of those against it. You admit you don't know enough about it to decide how to vote and yet you write an article about it using one sided comments.

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Mike Gambino

10:33 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Amen! the head lady over there failed in Ohio and they paid her big money to come down here and fail also. What a joke! Only it is not funny! it's a sad joke!

Jack Sartain

8:06 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Forgot to say I will vote for it - more than once if I can!!!

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Mike Gambino

10:34 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Me too. Anything to give parents and children more options. option are good, not bad,

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Monty Brewster

4:14 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

How many people have more options in a recession? Most people that understand how finances work will cut back spending when money isn't available.

Jlavandier

8:31 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Support public education and all of the intown and Midtown families working with their children, teachers and the school administration to make the local public schools the best they can be. Vote against amendment 1!

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Mike Gambino

10:38 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Why not give families and children the option? This is less about teaching children and more about teacher unions and highly paid administrative folks who don't want competition and/or to lose power over YOUR TAX MONEY that you so kindly send them every year. Well i am sorry, as Donald Trump would say "you had your shot and you are fired!" Vote yes for competition, student choice and yes for charter schools!

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Monty Brewster

4:15 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Competition? In education? Pitting teacher against teacher? That is asinine. Success in education comes from cooperation.

Shawn Keefe

8:42 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

If you trust the DCSD to do what is right and represent the best interests of every student in the district, vote no. If you don't trust the district who is running $20M+ in the red and paying little attention to the voices of parents, especially here in North Dekalb, VOTE YES! If you trust advocates for our children such as Nancy Jester, VOTE YES! If you'd rather listen to the likes of Eugene Walker, vote no and keep the power where the power-hungry wants it to be.

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Northerner in the South

12:45 pm on Friday, November 2, 2012

"...and paying little attention to the voices of parents, especially here in North Dekalb..." . Really? You have no idea as to how how many voices for change are being shouted in "South Dekalb" as well. Shame on you for dividing this county. We are all failing, and we all want what's best for our children.

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Shawn Keefe

1:12 pm on Friday, November 2, 2012

Northerner in the South (I am one as well), you must not have realized that this was posted in the Brookhaven Patch which is in NORTH DEKALB. Our children go to school in NORTH DEKALB and the parents whose voices I reference are in NORTH DEKALB. Shame on me for dividing this County??? How about shame on some members of the BOE for dividing this County??? Do 5/4 votes mean anything to you? Nice anonymous name, btw...

RJB1

9:04 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

VOTE NO! The For profit charter school folks are pouring money into the state in support of this unnecessary amendment. Charter schools are already allowed and legal, just not for profit.

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Kids First

6:51 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Keep in mind that a state approved charter school receives zero local dollars, even though theyre educating local children, and the state supplement to offset that zero amount puts them with the bottom funded 3 or 4 systems in the state. For profits aren't going to make a bazillion dollars. This is just not the best argument against the amendment. Public education and private business have always worked together.

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Eddie E.

6:57 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

If it is not funded by local dollars, where does the money come from?
Is it somehow NOT funded by taxpayer funds?

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Mike Gambino

10:39 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Vote Yes! This is less about teaching children and more about teacher unions and highly paid administrative folks who don't want competition and/or to lose power over YOUR TAX MONEY that you so kindly send them every year.

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Monty Brewster

4:16 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Where are the Teacher Unions in Georgia?

PhilHarmonic

9:12 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

We all want better schools but I feel that giving an as of yet unnamed state level commission the power to make decisions about how local school money is spent is not the best idea. We have charter schools and will continue to have charter schools whether or not this amendment passes...DeKalb County has 13, if I'm not mistaken. This new commission will add another level of bureaucracy to the mix and encourage a "Mom said no so let's go ask Dad" scenario. Our school boards are elected by us. If we are not happy with the decisions they are making we should voice our concerns with them and vote them out of office if we feel they are not working in our best interest. I am all for charter schools and giving parents more choices for education. Charter schools are all about giving parents more local control of their children's education. It doesn't make sense to move the decision making process on the establishment of these schools out of the local communities.

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Kids First

6:59 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Your state board of education is also appointed and they make huge decisions on behalf of education every day. The charter commission existed for three years and only approved 16schools out of nearly sixty...they just dint go crazy.

And it's not at all easy to vote out school board members. Did you know that Gwinnett County's board members, on average, have served over 20 years. It would take a great deal of time and money to overturn one of these guys, let alone four.

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Mike Gambino

10:40 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

This is less about teaching children and more about teacher unions and highly paid administrative folks who don't want competition and/or to lose power over YOUR TAX MONEY that you so kindly send them every year.

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Monty Brewster

4:18 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

It's about sending YOUR TAX MONEY to corporate CEO's. They will make MILLIONS in PROFIT off of one school alone. Why isn't that money going toward educating the children? CEO's of these corporations answer to their share holders not the parents.

David Bundrick

9:34 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

This question is not about whether one approves of charter schools or not. Rather, it is whether an appointed board controlled by political heavies can trump a decision of a local school board and force a charter school onto a community. With for-profit "educational" corporations pushing hard for this, and with the open corruption in Georgia's highest offices, it's easy to see why this is a bad idea. Vote "no" and we will still have charter schools.

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Kids First

7:02 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

A local district hears the petition first. No school will be considered by the local board or charter commission that can't prove local support. Remember that the schools are run by nonprofit governing boards. If they enter a contract with a management company, it's not all that different than the contracts traditional public schools enter with for profit companies like Ombudsman.

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Shawn Keefe

11:05 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

Prior to GA Supreme Court decision, only 16 of the 83 charter applications that came before the Georgia Charter School Commission were approved. The idea that EVERY charter application that goes before the State Commission is absurd.

Shawn Keefe

10:40 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

The myth that state commissioned Charter schools take money away from the local schools is getting out of hand. Educate yourselves...

Here is a good starting point: www.mattshultz.org

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Eddie E.

11:26 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Shawn,
Then where will the money come from?

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Shawn Keefe

12:16 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Eddie, currently, the average FTE spend per student in GA is roughly $9000 and the average charter FTE per student is $5500. If the local BOE approves a charter, the entire FTE follows the child. If the local BOE denies the charter and the charter then gets approved through the state appeal process, roughly 60% of the FTE follows the child to the charter and nearly 40% stays with the local system. It can be argued that it is better for the local system to lose a student to a state charter because they keep nearly 40% of the FTE money while at the same time they don't have the expense of edcuating that student. Listen, I am happy with my family's current situation and we are blessed to have Ashford Park, Chamblee Middle and Chamblee High School as our district schools AS LONG AS Dekalb School District stays solvent; however, what about the kids who happen to live in areas that have failing schools? What about young couples who bought houses in areas that were fun to live before children, but now cannot sell when they have kids and are looking for better schools? Voting YES for Amendment 1 is a vote for choice. Nobody is right or wrong on this issue -- we are all just looking for the best possible solutions to educate our children. BTW, great to see your businesses' signs at Ashford Park. The strength of the school is dependent on such community support, as you know.

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Eddie E.

12:39 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Shawn,
And if, for whatever reason, the student and the charter school part ways, what happens to the funding allocation?
My reading of the amendment does not indicate it follows the student who is discharged.
Maybe funding mechanisms should be a separate amendment and voted upon BEFORE changes in school oversight structure. Of course I won't hold my breath because methods for changing education funding were a state high school debate topic in 1972, when I was in high school.

And thanks for the notice!
It was time to reinvigorate my support of APS.

JasonInGP

10:50 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

When in doubt, vote 'no' on constitutional amendments. And there's plenty of doubt surrounding this.

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Kids First

7:04 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Don't be in doubt. But if you are, you should abstain and allow the voters who have researched the issue to decide.

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JasonInGP

8:19 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

Oh, I've done my research and will be voting 'no', without doubt. I'm suggesting to others who have doubts to vote no. It's one thing to adopt bad legislation and correct/amend it later. Constitutional amendments aren't as easily remedied.

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Kids First

8:48 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

Ok. Thought that was your strategy for all amendments. I don't vote for sheriff, coroner, and other positions because I don't know enough about them. I truly believe a vote no says to all the local boards in GA, 'keep up the good work'. I personally don't believe they will change a thing after they get your vote. Superintendent Wilbanks said in Sunday's televised debate that parental choice is over played. He likes his kingdom just the way it is :-)

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Shawn Keefe

10:54 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

Kids First -- wouldn't you for $400,000 / year? Wilbanks and POTUS - same salary...sad state of affairs.

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Mike Gambino

10:41 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Vote yes! Let the money follow the student, not the unions!

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Monty Brewster

4:19 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Money will follow the students... then right passed them to the CEO's pocket. Your kids will never see that money in the classroom.

MisterEnglishTeacher

11:32 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

5-6 billion dollars of state funding has been taken from GA public schools since 2003... It's no wonder public schools are hurting. Gwinnett alone is teaching 10,000 more kids with 2000 less teachers since 2008. The state has created the problem and then proposes a solution that takes more funding away from locally elected boards in lieu of an unaccountable bureaucracy...

There was a proposed amendment that would have prevented for-profit companies coming in to Georgia... but, not surprisingly, that amendment was dispatched. The wording of the amendment is manipulative at best... duplicitous at worse. 95% of the funding for the pro-amendment lobby is coming from out of state because they have the best interest of kids? I doubt it; there is money in dem dere hills and it breaks my heart to see such rapacity aimed at public education.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saQW_P1p51c

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Kids First

7:27 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

I can't open your link. This amendment is about letting parents, educators, and communities bring ideas to their neighborhood about a different way to learn. Assuming your an English teacher, you might enjoy some of the approaches through the classics and humanities...can't you see some of your students doing better in that environment? You probably also recognize the student who would do better in a science or tech focused school.

I have spoken to a lot of teachers quietly changing their vote. They're starting to consider petitioning to start charter schools. They and their founding board may or may not contract with a management company. It's up to them. They're overseeing the school's performance and will be held accountable. If you have time, watch the debate I inserted under the first post.

Tom Doolittle

11:42 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

I'm for any public school that can prove itself a better education for a reasonable amount of funding and smaller classrooms that is embraced by an entire community--or alternatively have neighbors at each others' throats (due to exclusion)--not destabilizing (massive neighborhood school evacuation)-- I favor "neighborhood" schools with EQUITABLE access in neighborhoods that have proven capacity to fully support their schools.

From those standpoints, charter schools hold great promise--and in the case of traditional schools that have been converted to charter schools, have proven themselves.

Unfortunately, we can only judge whether a particular (privately financed/built and operated/community led) school will do those things as they are approved and operated over a reasonable amount of time. Georgia has many with the biggest differences accomplished (even if still underperforming by averages) in the areas where results were the worst to being with.

If Amendment 1 had in place a limit of (privatized public) schools to be approved (Washington passed a law limiting to 7 per year for the next five years and has community poverty thresholds); an appeal process for stakeholders with community boundaries defined in charter applications; restrictions on municipal bonds used for financing; regulations against for companies "cherry picking" affluent areas; required van transport; ...

in other words...Amendment 1 is poor policy and poor law.

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Don Broussard

11:52 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012

If you believe in local oversight and control over public schools, then vote against this amendment. It is designed to overrule a decision by the Georgia Supreme Court which upheld the principle of LOCAL charter schools — not STATE charter schools. Local school boards can create —and have created—charter schools. This amendment will begin to create a two-tier system of public schools — a bad idea. As a former PTA co-president at Lakeside High, I agree we need to improve public schools — but there is NOTHING in this charter amendment that will fix things. As others have well stated, it is designed to create for-profit state schools.

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Eddie E.

12:41 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Don,
I am baffled at the sudden shift.
'Local Control' was the mantra from the late '50s in Georgia schools until the last few years (since 2003).
I hope dan weber's worst idea dies on November 6!

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Kids First

7:11 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

You're lucky to live in a system with a board that will approve quality public school options. We have 180 school systems with about 9 that have approved a charter school over the last 11years. Many other boards are 'rubber stamping' denied. Seriously, these petitions are about 100 pages and some boards have received that document on one day and it's returned the next day. this amendment will give those petitioners a place to appeal.

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Eddie E.

11:28 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

What suggests the immediate and overwhelming need to allow out-of-state, for-profit 'school-in-a-box' operations access to limited taxpayer funds?

I have not seen anything that demonstrates such a need and I would appreciate some clear, hard evidence.

Tim

12:45 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

The manipulative wording of the propossed amendment is enough to vote no...send a message that we want real leaders and honest, straight-forward ammendments when needed, not this game.

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Bruce Mitchell

1:06 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

The amendment amends nothing. Why would any sane person transfer control of individual school systems to one party, particularly one whose members sit in Atlanta but many of which don't represent the ATL MSA. That is better left to the counties as it is now.

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Shawn Keefe

1:33 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Mr. Mitchell: This is not a transfer of control. The control still lies with the County systems as they are the ones to approve/disapprove the charter applications. This establishes an appellate process. Should we get rid of the appellate process in the State judicial system and keep the ultimate control with the County courts? Why should it be any different with our education system?

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Bruce Mitchell

4:15 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Shawn K,
The one point that is essential to understand and accept in politics is that ones' point of view is solely based on ones' perception of what is in their best interest. Often this decision is not based on ones' own actual research but of another's' view, which may or may not be the same as if one did indeed conduct their own research. That being said, giving you the benefit of doubt, I accept your view. I, you see don't live in an area that is trying to divorce itself from the municipality at large. I am willing to respect the efforts of the shared populace that worked to create this unique (in GA) municipality of Dekalb, regardless as to how it evolves demographically. I am a transplant here (20yrs) but I realize how Dekalb county gained it's recent wealth. I am from the very area that has fueled a large percentage of the tax base (personal and corporate) and I see how certain elements are attempting to do what they've always done; exploit this windfall for the benefit of the privileged, or seemingly privileged and leave crumbs for the rest. This is in line with the powers that be who control virtually all of the state govt. Your analogy is flawed. The legal system is top down from the fed level. The same forces pushing this are themselves against the top down fed control of the educational system and have a history of resisting any federal intrusion into their administering "justice". So, to recap, I can understand your feeling's so maybe you will understand mine.

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Shawn Keefe

4:39 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

I appreciate the odd POLISCI 101 lesson. I perceive it is now in my best interest to go home to my family in the area that has recently divorced itself from the municipality that is Dekalb County. You are correct, the Judicial system is top down from the Federal government. Please remember, however, where the Educational system is top down from. Good day, Sir.

A Decatur Mom

1:53 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

I can understand why folks distrust the DeKalb County School System. And there are great charter schools that put DCSS to shame. But Amendment One is not a solution, it's just a transfer of power from one group we don't trust to another group we don't trust. It's like dealing with a gang by inviting another gang in to compete with it.

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Mike Gambino

10:42 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

I"ll take my chances with the new group vs. what we have now any day!

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Monty Brewster

4:20 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Mike is an investor in K12. He's playing the market with your children.

jamika

1:58 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

I voted against this simply because there are already charter schools in Georgia. They have the funding and are also funded privately, so why take away from public schools?! Secondly, there are ways put in place to put children in charter schools and the parents need to take the steps to put their children onto those schools. Lastly, if this passes, what are parents going to do if the school fails in the curriculum?
I believe the best solution is for parents, teachers, and students stand up against politicians and leaders who are constantly attacking our public education system and say enough is enough!

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"E Pluribus Unum"

2:25 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Not at all. This has nothing to do with improving education. This is just another ploy by organizations who already make a lot of money with Charter Schools to make even more money. It's also interesting to see the amount of $ and interest from folks outside of Georgia in this amendment. Even the lovely Koch brothers...imagine why. And finally, why would I want to trust the current dominant leadership in the Georgia GA?

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David D

10:45 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

Amen. This amendment strengthens political patronage of the ruling political party in the State.

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Kids First

12:16 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

You are absolutely right! Of course I'm speaking of the current school systems as the ruling political power. Did you know the Georgia Charter Schools Commission had 7 volunteer Commissioners and about 5 paid staffers when it was operational. Its budget was about $650k. That $650k was paid by the charters from operational funds (and they'd have to pay this even if they were locally approved). The Commission, at the time, oversaw 15,000 students.

COMPARE: There are 21 districts in our state with a general administration budget of $650k or less. Added together these districts serve 24,000 students. Combined, their general administration expenditures was over 11 MILLION.

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Eddie E.

2:19 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

KF,
Just wait until you have CEO's whining about the dividends the 'shareholders are entitled to' for 'risking their capital'.
ALEC doesn't care about charter funding. Their goal is to kill PUBLIC education.

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Kids First

2:27 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Eddie, I'm not concerned because the school leaders are a nonprofit governing board.

I really don't have a problem with people making a profit if they're providing a service. I guess you'd condemn me too since I sold into the public education world in the early 2000s. I made money and paid for silly things like vacations....I guess that was a profit at the expense of the school systems. I don't do it anymore but the fear you keep trying to spread just doesn't resonate with me, perhaps others.

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Eddie E.

2:37 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

KF,
Oh now you are really pulling on my heart strings (NOT)!
The Tax Dollars can only be spent once, let's spend them on SMALLER CLASSES in PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
If somehow that doesn't work, then we can look at wasting money on unproven concepts.

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Kids First

2:49 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

hee hee Eddie. I wasn't trying to play your heartstrings, I was trying to point out how paranoid of profit you sound. I also think we've given the public schools many many years to do the right thing. Did you know Dr. Ben Scalfidi, Professor of Economics, Georgia College and State University notes from 1992-2009:

Growth of students in Georgia: 41%
Growth of School Personnel: 80%
Growth of Teachers: 86%
Growth of Administrators and Staff: 74%.

As I have said... our central office spending is outpacing education fund earnings. And they wonder why they are cash strapped?
http://www.georgiapolicy.org/have-u-s-schools-become-just-another-jobs-program/

David Bundrick

2:53 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

This is not at all an appellate process, it is an override. An appellate court corrects errors committed by the trial court. The only error a local board of education could make is to deny a charter that politically connected elements want granted. It's a judgment call, and in those cases an appellate court does not substitute its judgment for that of the trial court. absent some articulated error.

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Shawn Keefe

4:26 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Except in those situations where a BOE denies a charter simply to keep the 38% of the FTE per student within the system which is an ERROR. Passing of the Amendment does not mean each and every charter that is denied at the local level will receive an automatic acceptance by the State. If a charter is denied at the local level for valid reasons, then the same should happen at the State level. However, if a charter is denied for the wrong reasons, an appellate option should be available.

ELF

3:09 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

typical. afraid of competition, and outright lying about funding. Boy the rats on the gravy train sure are getting scared! we rank 49th in USA educational stastics ( take THAT Mississippi! ) Vote Yes, and give inner city poor kids a choice!

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Greengirl

6:21 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Many people keep mentioning their corrupt local boards, namely DCSS, and as a resident of DeKalb I agree, they stick. However, this Amendment doesn't affect just DeKalb, Fulton, or even Clayton, it affects the entire state of Georgia. That's about 150 counties and about 180 school districts. I understand the frustrations of those who are dealing with problamatic boards, mine included. However, the vast majority of districts do not have these problems. This Amendment would give new power to the State allowing an unelected group to intervene and overrule local elected Boards. I just don't see giving this power to the State. We can work hard to change our local boards, but that change will be meaningless if in the meantime we give away our local power to the State and surrender out political voice to a panel of political appointees.

Also, the wording of this Amendment is highly misleading. If it is such a worthy idea, why did they feel the need to mask the intent in deceitful language.

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Daniel H.

8:27 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

The rally for the amendment may be bipartisan but it would serve everyone well to know that the Democrat Alicia Thomas Morgan's top campaign contributor in 2010 was American Federation For Children, a group created to push vouchers and privately owned public school charters.
http://ballotpedia.org/wiki/index.php/Alisha_Thomas_Morgan
Click on 2010 campaign contributions. For some reason it is hidden whereas 2008 is not.
American federation for Children:
http://www.federationforchildren.org/

Chip Rogers is the state chairman representing ALEC, American Legislation Exchange Council:
http://www.alecexposed.org/wiki/ALEC_%26_Education#Tipping_the_Scales_in_Favor_of_Charter_Schools_Over_Public_School_Innovations
ALEC has several model bills allowing for the privatization of public schools in several states.

The state of Georgia already has the means to create charters locally and an option to apply to the state if the charter is denied. This change to the State Constitution is not necessary. We must ask why then it is being pursued so strongly with such misleading ballot language.
Follow the money.

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Kids First

9:07 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Unfortunately Daniel the PTA state lobbyist has said in a public forum that a lawsuit will be brought against the state if they try to approve a charter the local district denied if this amendment doesn't pass. The supreme court ruled that districts have exclusive control. And for many, allowing them to decide to approve a charter school is like McDonalds getting to approve or deny a Burger King down the block. They aren't thinking about the kids, just their funding.

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Eddie E.

11:31 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Daniel,
Quite correct, and especially Alicia uses the void in ethics enforcement to further her and her husband's business interests.

With regards to ALEC, without their external meddling (and lap-dog compliance from GA ALEC members), we would not be subjected to this 'stealing' amendment.

Yet another place where the machinations under the Gold Dome have infused a solution where there is no problem (aside from the fact that the campaign contributors lack direct access to taxpayer funds.)

Rae Harkness

10:44 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

See this link, and read the posts....this is why we need Amendment ! .... Vote YES! http://dekalbschoolwatch.wordpress.com/

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Simone Joye

11:13 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

Voted YES! and would do it again if I could..about the students and parents!

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Kids First

11:50 pm on Thursday, October 25, 2012

I voted yes too! Lots of conspiracy theories abound but charter schools are simply options for families. Spoke to a woman recently who went through this about 15 years ago hen she wanted to home school. The 'system' didn't want that either and fought it hard. They really hate to be threatened. I wish they'd see the different approaches as a successful way to educate all our children.

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ELF

8:39 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

I stand corrected, Eddie. It appears Georgia mean SAT scores us 48th instead of 49th http://www.commonwealthfoundation.org/policyblog/detail/2010-sat-scores-by-state
If you are a parent of school aged children in Fulton or Dekalb county and you vote 'no' you are voting against your childs best interests. competition invites performance. vote yes for poor inner city kids with parents that care!

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Eddie E.

2:21 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

I am the parent of an Honors Graduate from Dekalb County Public Schools.

And I will vote NO!

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Monty Brewster

9:34 pm on Saturday, October 27, 2012

ELF - if you have the ability, you may want to analyze the information on the link you posted. Georgia tests 80% of its student population. There are only four states that test a higher percentage. In fact, 18 of the top 20 test less than 10% of their top students. Using this information is inaccurate and flawed. But supporters of the amendment are desperate and willing to lie, or at least skew the truth to make people think our schools are failing.

Tom Doolittle

8:50 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

ELF--SATs as test are so yesterday--and you are just parroting the interests of "progress" (monry making). We rank in the top 10 for % of students who take the test and Top 15 for states with over 40% taking the test.
So yesterday--so for profit--including the AJC causing contraversy for $.

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Shawn Keefe

11:00 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

Very informative letter in the Buford Patch from former members of Georgia Charter School Commission...

http://buford.patch.com/articles/former-members-of-the-georgia-charter-commission-speak-out-3fd55f08

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Roswell Parent

8:24 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Great article. Thanks. I'll vote Yes!

ELF

11:13 am on Friday, October 26, 2012

more excuse making. *rolls eyes* Both my wife and I are former teachers who enrolled our child in ANCS in Grant Park. You know that one the 'burned down' on a saturday in 2002? Or how about Kipp which 'conveniently' burned down last year at 5am? Please dont begin to think about 'schooling' me on whats going on down here. We live it. When I worked at the Children's School in the 90's, all the people who threw out flattering stats about APD ( like Bill Cambell and Hosea Williams, most of the City Council, etc..) sent thier kids there. Vincent Fort is against the CS amendment, sat on the Senate Education Comittee, yet did his children go to the public schools? Call and ask, I will even give you his # 463 2260. Go ahead! How about this nice little stat: http://www.trulia.com/real_estate/Grant_Park-Atlanta/2588/schools/
Now, the ANCS outperforms EVERY school around it. Previous to it's inception, you only choices were private $chools or moving. I want this kind of 'choice' Statewide. And the reason we have this discussion in the first place is the local BOE's SUED the State to remove the old CS 3 person commission, and they have been doing a piss-poor job. Vote yes so other kids have a 'choice' just like the local politicians and board members who send thier precious snowflakes to out of district schooling because they KNOW how awful it is!

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Eddie E.

2:23 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Wait a minute. A problem with Kipp?
That was always the prime example of success that dan weber would trot out when this was just an un-Constitutional Senate Bill.
Say it ain't so!

Tom Doolittle

2:31 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Yes Shawn--very informative: where can one find these requirements and regulatory details in the law? I'm still looking for the requirement that private companies recruiting local groups for business would do that in low income, underperforming areas before they mine for already-performing zone--or maybe has one in the underperforming area for every one in a performing area--or maybe for those "mechanistic" companies (with dozens of schools--see Florida) that they be required to open 5 schools for every one in a performing area.

I'm also looking for the appeal process where 95% of a community DOESN'T want a charter school in their area.

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Eddie E.

2:39 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Florida?
Oh yeah that's right. jeb bush is one of the owners of school-in-a-box companies and one of the funders of this amendment isn't he?

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Shawn Keefe

2:52 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Where can one find details of any charter school approved by the Georgia Charter School Commission where 95% of the community did not want the charter school in their area? In addition, state charter schools, by law, are governed by non-profit boards and can purchase the services of NPO's or for-profit companies the same way GaDOE and local school systems purchase services from non-profits and FOR-PROFITS on a daily basis.

Tom Doolittle

2:42 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Here's a mistake by a local school district trying to "do the right thing"--

This school also got an economic development bond from the City of Alpharetta to build--financing from a city? City school. Why? Because they thought it would bring business to town square--maybe it would--still inappropriate public funding. Really, someone needed to unload some real estate.

There obviously are many articles but found this off the AJC beaten path that most people read (its confusing, but comments below are interesting too).
http://alpharetta.patch.com/articles/charter-school-advocate-and-mom-will-vote-no

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Shawn Keefe

2:58 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Is Ivy Prep in Norcross a success story? How were they approved? How are the results looking?:

http://int.ivyprepacademy.org/ivy-prep-outperforms-gwinnett-again/

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Tom Doolittle

3:00 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Profit for who? This goes wayyyyyy beyond management companies and suppliers. Bearing on the explosivity and scammy reasons this will explode with full funding: The people that make money have nothing to do with education--real estate, bond dealers, attorneys--even on the stock market:

stock market (note relevance to the private college scam--and stock bubble):
http://truth-out.org/news/item/12117-education-profiteering-wall-streets-next-big-thing

real estate:
http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/09/19/v-fullstory/2541051_florida-charter-schools-big-money.html#storylink=addthis

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Shawn Keefe

3:05 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Just as it exploded back when the State commission was approving a whopping 13 of 86 applications?

Tom Doolittle

3:35 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

shawn shawn shawn--these are different times and most importantly more funding available under the law. The apps will quintuple and approvals will be fast and furious--there are more companies licking their chops--other states have increased the momentum--financiers will exert greater pressure, much more "creative"...

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Tom Doolittle

3:39 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

shawn--the argument that we shoudln't fear whole new "charter industrial complex" because we already have a "public school industrial complex" is contradictory. What would we want with a second industrial complex which will be more "parallel" than "competitive"--the same damn people--double the profit?

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ELF

3:40 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

http://www.gpb.org/blogs/passion-for-learning/2012/10/23/charter-school-amendment-debate#

I showed this link to some of my younger friends and neighbors and asked them to truthfully give me thier opinion. They all agreed that the anti-charters looked terrible. I challenge anyone who is undecided to watch this video, then make up your own mind.

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Shawn Keefe

3:45 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Tom, I appreciate the talking down to. We can agree to disagree over your paranoia. Good day, Sir.

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Tom Doolittle

4:08 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Shawn--I can see where my comments, because they were directed to you, might be considered condescending. I apologize for that.

But I fail to see what is "paranoid" (condescending on your part, given how the term is directed these days) in showing what has happened in other situations as systems tend to expand, although there are always unintended consequences--I believe some are intended.
However, I can also see where we may have beaten this to death and agree to retire.

ELF

3:45 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

the most damning part is when Valarie Wilson started whining about vouchers. You could tell her interest was not about 'the kids'. More like protecting the 'system'. watch that video and tell me who you think is really looking out for the kids.

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A Decatur Mom

2:09 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Unfortunately, Valerie Wilson's style is to whine, not an effective persuasive technique. But the folks concerned about Amendment One passing do not have huge coffers behind them like the Amendment promoters do so don't have the same kind of level of promotion and oratory. Valerie Wilson's school district, City Schools of Decatur, is in little danger of charters coming in, so she is arguing on behalf of the good of all kids in the state, not just her district's.

Eddie E.

6:06 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

I guess such belief in faeries is the result of 20 years of faux-newz and an inculcation with the falsehood that 'the free market always does a better job'.
I also guess that is why common sense opposition seems to catch people flat footed, even when the catch commercials don't automatically change people's minds.

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ELF

6:51 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

again, the 'reason' we are 'having this discussion' is because the CURRENT SYSTEM is NOT working. The ROI is awful. were 47th in GRADUATING kids. Facts. It's too far gone, now. Dollittle, too late. Sorry, double E the ride os OVER. Competition is here, step up your game or get out of the way! #waiting for superman

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Eddie E.

8:30 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Could the reason the system is troubled stem from the intentional defunding from the State level over the last 9 years?
If you want to make parents unhappy, force school systems and teachers to perform the impossible with inadequate funding.
And please don't quote that lame, pathetic movie (funded by for-profit school proponents) as a justification.
I'm glad there are not a sufficient number of people who believe in 'free market magic' nonsense to pass this monstrosity.

Roswell Parent

8:24 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

I'm all for reforming public schools so our children are prepared to work in a rapidly evolving technical society. Unfortunately, change will take decades if we expect it to come from the people who are working within the "system". Just like in business, we need a "disruptive technology" to change the paradigm of education. Charters are the closest thing I know to that, though there are other hopeful ways... like the Khan Academy on YouTube. I'm voting YES.

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Tom Doolittle

10:17 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Eddie you said:
"I'm glad there are not a sufficient number of people who believe in 'free market magic' nonsense to pass this monstrosity."
Unfortunately for civilization, there have enough been in any state its been offered and plenty will just check "yes" here. BTW--the only difference between this and the TSPLOST we "cancelled" is that people think it's free..
...and conservatives back it lock stock and barrel...no Tea Party opposition.

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Tom Doolittle

10:32 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Here EE:
We've got work to do:
“Metro Atlantans currently support the Charter Schools Amendment by a 53%-32% margin, while the Amendment currently is losing by one point among Georgians outside of Metro Atlanta, 42-41%,” said John Garst, President of Rosetta Stone Communications.

The poll was commissioned by WSB-TV Channel 2 Action News in Atlanta and was conducted Thursday evening, October 25, 2012. The poll has a margin of error of 4.3%.

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Eddie E.

11:44 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Tom,
Of course, rosetta stone might just be polishing the feces.
They have never been known for their stellar neutrality.

Tom Doolittle

10:24 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

Education leaders in Finland (you know the global leader in those test results that put the US last of all the developed world, politicians use conveniently--mainly Republicans)--
they think moving to market based schools is the worst thing any nation can do.

They are quite honest that they know much of our difficulty with public school "performance" in the US is socio-economic disparity--and are quite certain that market based schools will fair no better under the same conditions.

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Eddie E.

11:43 pm on Friday, October 26, 2012

For anyone on the fence (or in favor because somebody they 'trust' thinks it's a good idea) take a moment, enlighten yourself. There is nothing new in this 'amendment' and the focus has nothing whatsoever to do with improvement of publicly financed education.

If you have never visited the site, please, go to www.alecexposed.org.
Read the proposals on education carefully and look at what it is the 'business friendly community' really wants to do with YOUR tax money.
If this still seems like the greatest idea since sliced bread to you, I don't know what to say.
But if you fall within the average, middle class, too busy to stay on top of things that might sneak up on you, I feel a few minutes of enlightenment might provide you with sufficient cold sweat to not only vote against this nonsense, but go out and find at least three other people to vote against it.
Once a stupid 'stealing' policy like this is in place, the road back to sanity is very, very difficult.

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Monty Brewster

12:47 am on Saturday, October 27, 2012

Why do we need this amendment? The state can already approve charter schools if the local boards do not. I just do not trust the legislators on this one. The wording is completely biased and there are too many questions as to what will happen to the rest of the children that are left behind in the underfunded public schools.

Educational reform is needed, but I don't believe this Amendment will solve the problems we are experiencing in education. Where is all the money coming from to open all these new schools if money isn't being pulled away from public schools?

Something is fishy.

I'm voting NO in NOvember.

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Tom Doolittle

11:58 am on Saturday, October 27, 2012

EE--that's becoming clear. I couldn't have put your statement more diplomatically. Altho from firends I know they do work on both sides of the aisle. (Oh shoot! This isn't partisan--then again almost nothing really is).

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Tom Doolittle

11:24 pm on Saturday, October 27, 2012

Monty Brewster: you said--
"ELF - if you have the ability, you may want to analyze the information on the link you posted. Georgia tests 80% of its student population. There are only four states that test a higher percentage. In fact, 18 of the top 20 test less than 10% of their top students. "
That's only the beginning--we are also the 4th largest immigration state-and wer'e not talking about doctors and engineers. You don't suppose that affects our test scores does it?
Oh--and dropout rate? Every state does that differently--and Georgia's system penalizes schools--mainly because they don't know who of that immigrant population is "dropping out" and who is moving from school to school (THEY DON'T TRACK RECEIVING SCHOOLS!!)--your parents move from free-rent special to free-rent special every six months? You're a dropout.
I think somewhere there are stats on Georgia's Top 25% (still far higher % than most states test-takers)--we're in the Top 10 in the freaking country!!
Where do you suppose we'd be just doing the Top 10% (like Minnesota's 9 goddam %)--we'd be in the Top 5!!!!!!
BTW--

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ELF

8:26 am on Sunday, October 28, 2012

here we go again. bad stats? excuses. "Oh, the reason we stink on SAT's is because we make all our 'little dummies' take the test." boo hoo. The reason we rank 47th in graduating kids? Blame the immigrants *rolls eyes*. Cheatting scandal? Dont blame the teachers who cheat, blame the test. Or, the kids: http://atlanta.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/school-teacher-helps-students-cheat-because-she-says-theyre-dumb-as-hell/
quite frankly, spin away all you want but it wont pass the 'sniff test'. When the local politicians and APD Board members ENROLL thier own kids in these failing schools, and not high priced private schools, THEN we might see a change. For now, Charter Schools fill that void: at least in my neghborhood. Vote Yes and give other kids a chance.

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Monty Brewster

11:35 am on Sunday, October 28, 2012

So we begin acting childish when your use of inaccurate, irrelevant statistics is called out? The spin is using the "apples to oranges" comparison, saying we are last in the nation. You must be quite disoriented as your sniff test seems to be up the backside of the corrupt legislators. How about the ethics ranking of 50th in the country? There's a good stat for you to use.

Here's what you can expect if this amendment passes:
California - http://articles.latimes.com/2012/aug/24/local/la-me-banks-cheating-scandal-20120825
Louisiana - http://www.nola.com/education/index.ssf/2012/08/new_orleans_charter_school_is.html
Florida - http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/12/10/v-fullstory/2541157/how-some-states-rein-in-charter.html
New York - http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/13/education/online-schools-score-better-on-wall-street-than-in-classrooms.html?_r=0
* http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/02/03/AR2010020303959.html
* http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/local/articles/2010/02/08/20100208charterschools0208.html

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Tom Doolittle

1:04 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

ELF--don't blame the system using stats unless you're prepared to defend the stats. You got a case to make? Make them without bad stats.

Lets get back to basics--very few people disagree that school choice is a good thing. Let's do charters the way we're doing them, do conversion charters the way we're doing them, allow local zones to start their own STEM schools and other alternate methods. Just don't enshrine privatizing the public school system by favoring that alternative from a General Assembly that doesn't have 10% of the forethought and regulatory regime required to keep CharterGeddon under control.

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Tom Doolittle

1:18 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

thanks Monty Brewster for this:

http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/12/10/v-fullstory/2541157/how-some-states-rein-in-charter.html

(see 7th comment below story)
"FOUR SCHOOLS I HELPED GO TO A CONVERSION CHARTER SCHOOL TODAY ARE ALL "A" SCHOOLS WITH A CASH RESERVE AT THE END OF THE SCHOOL WITH OVER $2,500,000 MILLION DOLLARS ON THE LOW SIDE AND $4,500,000 MILLION ON THE HIGH SIDE BASED ON STUDENT POPULATION.

DO NOT ALLOW THESE MANAGEMENT COMPANIES SUCK UP ALL THOSE TAX DOLLARS AND LEAVE THE CHILDREN BEHIND SINCE THEY ARE A FOR PROFIT COMPANY. THEY HAVE INVESTORS AND STOCKHOLDERS TO ACCOUNT FOR NOT YOUR CHILD OR YOU.

BE SMART AND USE THE LAW TO YOUR ADVANTAGE, THEY ARE COUNTING ON YOU AND YOUR COMMUNITY NOT TO BE SMART ENOUGH TO RUN A SCHOOL.

WOLFGANG W HALBIG
352-729-2559

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RJB1

2:03 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Tom Doolittle - CharterGeddon is a great image.

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Tom Doolittle

3:13 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

thanks--I need a cartoonist.

Anyway--I've been busy-- extra-local perpective for my neck of the woods:

http://northdruidhills.patch.com/blog_posts/no-chartergeddon-law-stems-conversion-charters-ib-programs-will-do-fine
http://northdruidhills.patch.com/blog_posts/charter-commission-vote-lakeside-chartergeddon-portents-community-strife

Another one coming out predicting a new wave of lotteries that will ensue (Kittredge-on-Steroids)--plenty there for "charter envy" (like magnet envy) to poison our neighborhood gatherings and church groups.

Rae Harkness

2:51 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

@Decatur Mom,
Valarie Wilson is speaking as President of GSBA. Saying she is speaking on behalf of all of the children in the State is as far from the truth as it gets.

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Tom Doolittle

3:19 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Acquaint yourselves with a parallel blog (register and comment)-note tho that the blog is targeted at DeKalb schools dysfunction, so most there have a bit of a provincial view of the need for a STATE law--in my view biting off far more than they can chew and toothpaste they will want to put back in a tube later.

http://dekalbschoolwatch.wordpress.com/2012/10/28/fran-millar-why-i-will-vote-yes-on-the-charter-school-amendment/

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Monty Brewster

3:31 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Rae, would that be like Nina Rudin and all the Charter Principals emailing their employees about what to say to parents and friends about the amendment, and then saying they weren't trying to influence anyone?

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Rae Harkness

4:53 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

I don't know about that, but I do know about the emails and flyers sent home with the kiddies telling their parents to Vote NO

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Monty Brewster

5:08 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Well, that is further proof that the proponents of this amendment have no idea of what is really happening around them. This was covered nationwide by the Associated Press. Meanwhile, where is this so called flyer sent home to vote no? Can you produce said article?

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Rae Harkness

5:31 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Whether or not I do, it really doesn't matter. It wouldn't change your mind if I did and would only hurt someone else in the process. My point is, Valarie and the other leaders of Educator organizations AND charter groups have a right to speak, I am simply pointing out that her interests lie with GSBA, not all the children of Georgia.

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Monty Brewster

5:41 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

So, she can't speak on their behalf, but you can speak for her? All the while spreading rumors without any evidence. Sounds like that pretty much sums up the whole campaign for the amendment supporters.

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Rae Harkness

5:45 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Hmmm...Sounds like what the opponents have been doing all along. But like I said, nothing I say will change your mind. And of course, nothing you say will change mine.

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Monty Brewster

6:29 pm on Sunday, October 28, 2012

Rae, I'm not on here to convince you otherwise. You've clearly made up your mind. I'm on here because I have children that attend public schools and have seen class size rise drastically over the last few years as funding continues to decrease. More charters will cause further decrease in funding that will go towards the new charters. I'll be honest with you, in that I would normally support charter schools, but the people supporting this amendment have done nothing other than attack our schools in order to promote charters. While that has nothing to do with this Amendment, it is the campaign. I'm on here to help those voters that are undecided to not be fooled by the untruths and fear-filled rumors spread by many supporters of the Amendment.

The Amendment is about creating a separate commission that does not answer to the voters of Georgia. They are even given incentive to approve charters as they will receive a 3% kickback. This commission will essentially do the same exact thing that the State DOE is already doing. It's more bureaucracy.

Education is continually changing. Legislators change laws and educational policy all the time. Curriculum is changed all the time. They start something and then it doesn't work and start something else wasting money all over the place. Those mistakes are easily changed, but we don't get that money back. Changing the STATE CONSTITUTION is a HUGE deal and won't be easily changed after we see how we all been duped.

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Tom Doolittle

8:39 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Button:
You want the gubmn't to start a completely new industry (entitlement) with tax dollars based on "MAYBE"? This isn't an experiment--it's a vortex that will suck in everything anywhere near it--all community energy (lotteries, meetings, envy, arguments, accusations of corruption and favoritism with people who once called themselves friends), evacuation of current schools (and buildings), bond financing, real estate transactions ...and that's BEFORE any reviews of school performance and financial management begin (which will take a few years to get a good picture)...toothpaste that can NEVER be put back in a tube...

...all based on the MAYBE of poorly thought out law and process.

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Eddie E.

8:41 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Tom,
And 'we have to do it now' before there is enough evidence in place to prove it is a waste of time and money!

Tom Doolittle

9:33 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Amazing that all of the attention on Amendment 1 is allowing Amendment 2 to just slip and out. It's just so "coincidental" that the Leg wants "state agencies" to be able to have multi-year leases. Interesting to see how that will be used to assist the placement of "public" schools with privatized operations. The Charter "School Board" will be a state agency--and the schools will be defined as an extension of that agency. City bonds or private investment will develop the property and buildings based on guaranteed taxpayer payback--covering the apparent shortfall in per pupil allocation between local schools and charter schools.

(Of course, Amendment 2 really is a payoff to a weak property development industry in every respect--school development will just be one area).

Voters (aka citizens) don't stand a chance against the special interest Referendum industry. Somebody please stop it in its tracks (railroad tracks).

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Ormewood Park Mom

9:37 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

All Atlanta public schools are atrocious. It's too bad that most people in Atlanta have never seen a public school system that you are proud to be a part of for your children's growth. Until there is a fundamental change in overall vision and leadership the APS will continue to fail our children. I wouldn't send our kids to APS or charter if you paid me.

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Monty Brewster

4:21 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Atlanta has a lot of charters.

ELF

10:17 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

http://www.greatschools.org/georgia/atlanta/2651-Neighborhood-Charter-School/
http://www.trulia.com/real_estate/30316-Atlanta/
OPM, I share in your disgust at the sorry state of the APD. If your moniker is accurate, we are neighbors. I live in Ormewood Park as well.
My child attends ANCS, and is 'on the spectrum'. Given the sorry choices (look at the links above ) what 'choices' did I have? A: sell and move to a better school district, Not really an option. B: private school. A viable option. C: Parkside Elementary ( we 'toured' this school in 2010-11 the principal exclaimed 'we were one of the non-cheating schools, 4 weeks later the truth comes out) not an option. D: Atlanta Neighborhood Charter School. An option.

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ELF

10:17 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

What the power brokers and vested interest peeps ( just read through the thread, usually these people are more concerned with protecting thier rackets then actually giving inner city kids a choice) dont want you to know is 'how' this CS succeeds. Why it does better then Imagine Wesley and Stanton? Part of the reason is the fact that while ANCS does not 'hand pick' it's students ( baldface lie, there) it does 'hand pick' the parents involvement. You simply cannot be a 'drop em off and forget em' parent there. If you dont try to make a difference: by volunteering part of your time, by actively getting involved with your childs education, they can boot you and your kid right out the door, and there is a line of kids waiting to fill that spot. If a teacher stinks, they get canned. If the principle drops the ball: she gets fired. If the school slip below the minimum standard ( whic will never happen) the school gets CLOSED.We've seen this is simply not the case in Fulton and Dekalb County. And DeKalb county is abhorrent. The obvious corruption and incompetance makes me weep for those poor kids over there. At least we have an option in Ormewood Park if you child gets the lucky ping pong ball.
Vote yes and break the stranglehold. For the kids!

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Mike Gambino

10:30 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Let the money follow the child. Not the school, the teacher or the administration. If you let the money follow the child you will start to see "real" improvements. Vote Yes to Charter Schools!

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Mike Gambino

10:42 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Why not give families and children the option? This is less about teaching children and more about teacher unions and highly paid administrative folks who don't want competition and/or to lose power over YOUR TAX MONEY that you so kindly send them every year. Well i am sorry, as Donald Trump would say "you had your shot and you are fired!" Vote yes for competition, student choice and yes for charter schools!

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Monty Brewster

4:24 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Can you show us some math regarding YOUR TAX MONEY? How much money to you pay into educational taxes? How much is going toward your child? Does every child cost the same to educate?

A Decatur Mom

11:03 am on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

Re flyers going home from school systems urging parents to vote no: I have seen none. Has anyone else? Can we see proof? This seems like more manipulation of the truth, just like the wording of the Amendment.

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Monty Brewster

4:23 pm on Tuesday, October 30, 2012

This is just a crying point for them. They do it so they assume that districts must as well.

Dean

6:16 pm on Monday, January 14, 2013

More parent choice. Excellent move.

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Tom Doolittle

7:17 pm on Monday, January 14, 2013

More parent choice yes--but is this the way?
Lets get "educated"--round 27.

http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/Bridging-Differences/2011/10/the_trouble_with_the_parent_tr.html

(excerpt)
"...But giving the current parents the power to close the school or to hand it over to a private management company is akin to saying that whoever uses any public facility should have the same power, the power to transfer control to a private entity. It means if those who use Central Park in Manhattan don't like the way the city of New York takes care of it, they should be able to sign a petition and privatize it. If a majority of those who patronize a national park sign a petition, they should be able to hand control of the park over to private managers. This makes no sense.
The Parent Trigger should be recognized for what it is: A stealth assault on public ... (assets)

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Sally

8:33 am on Tuesday, January 15, 2013

Someone trying to protect the status quo? Our country has always worked this way. If the public is unhappy with a government run unit, they can change it. Via petitions or whatever.

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Monty Brewster

8:50 am on Tuesday, January 15, 2013

The status quo is over spending. Where are all these funds coming from to pay for new charters?

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