Neither represent "good" people in my humble opinion. They have other traits, but "good people" isn't among them.

Mr. E.: Please substantiate your baseless innuendo that Mr. Davis, Mrs. Williams, Mr. Gebbia and Mr. Mattison are corrupt. If you want to talk corruption, please look no further than your close friends in Dekalb government.

Yes, Eddie, could you be a bit more specific on the proven corruption that the candidates that YOU DO NOT support are guilty of?

Why waste my time?

You guys find nothing wrong with the ample evidence before you.

Thanks, Eddie. I will put that down as "I want to make accusations anonymously rather than be held to a higher standard."

Got it. Thanks for playing.

Look at that, Mr. E. is promoting Ms. Lord who is probably the remaining candidate most active in the Republican party. Good for you, Mr. E.

Phil,
You have repeatedly stated you support the current 'pay-to-play' candidate (as defined in the Campaign Contribution Disclosure Reports), so what constitutes an 'accusation' as there is certainly nothing anonymous?

Eddie I will agree with you regarding Mr. Quirk but not because of the fictionalized claim of corruption. If I lived in his district i'd probably vote for him.

Paying to Play is a false issue. Show the proof and I will proclaim it to all. But there is NO PAY TO PLAY. Jim Ehre is our insurance policy--it will never now.

Phil,
You do suggest a clear choice.
I would choose a mayor who was not involved in bringing a city to bear on those areas who were not consulted and did not vote for it!

Vote Sandy Murray for Mayor!

Mr. E.: The State of Georgia did not vote for BO to be our POTUS but we have to accept the results of that election. What makes you and your whining little gang of NoCity'ers any different?

jg,
My aren't you a spokesmodel for municipal cohesion.
Of course, I am quite glad that the President was re-elected and might bring Federal revenues back into semblance of reality (i.e. 1993-2000) and spur the growth for which our country is known.
Of course I was born in this Country and accept the oversight of our Federal, State and County Governments.
I didn't ask for invention of any additional layers of government (and neither did most of the People living in districts 2, 3 and 4).
'whining gang' indeed!

Interesting commentary John Galt... as it seems you are implying that a bankruptcy lawyer is of higher moral standing than a union lawyer!?!? Or that a commissioner on the Dekalb Co. Zoning Appeals board (i.e. an actual Dekalb Co. Bureaucrat) is somehow better than someone who "might be" in the back pocket of such bureacrats (baseless accusation I would say!). Dude, think before you speak!!!

Mr. Turner: You are correct, this DUDE, thinks a lawyer who assists individuals who need bankruptcy representation is of a higher moral standing than a Union lawyer. It is a shame that the NoCity gang of Imlay, Cobb, Konas, etc cannot rely on an "outsider" such as yourself to vote on December 4th for Sandy Murray. Enjoy life in unincorporated Dekalb County.

JG,
I do want to live in a place where Liberal Democrats are charged with oversight of governance from top to bottom.
I certainly do not want anything to do with the clouded 'vision' that has pitted area families against one another.

Tell J Max that even Mitt Romney couldn't buy his way into office.

John, Which candidates are taking money from Potential Vendors?
You consider that honorable?
Would this city be so bad if Lowes Engineering did not win a city contract?
Will this city come to a crumbling rubble pile if Giordano and Associates is not offering services to our city?

Brookhaven4u -- your assumptions are very amusing. No contracts are even close to being awarded, but please keep up with the conspiracy theories for our entertainment.

Right John Galt: You say no contracts awarded yet - unfortunately it will be too late when they have been awarded to those that line Davis' pockets. I presume you also say "we're not over-budget yet" but anyone with a brain knows we will be.

Your remarks are pure puffery.

Mr. Fitzpatrick has been in private practice for 8 years which covers many areas of practice. We will be having most of the services of Brookhaven contracted out to the private sector. What is the problem? What are the qualities that you would look for in a city counsel person? It is clear that some candidates take every opportunity to use insider resources to bring forward partisan affiliations in a nonpartisan race. This drives negative rhetoric and fear. Who has a vision? Who has experience in oversight of large budget keeping a mission insight? Who has the skill to respectfully listen to people and facilitate compromise among competing issues?

Another thumping for jmaxjr. that I had forgotten about.

Phil,
When one openly stands on a stage in front of Citizens requesting their vote and claims 'pay to play is over', one would assume there is sufficient consideration in place for ensuring one's campaign coffers are free from donations that might be viewed as questionable by those same voters.
A candidate should be careful about the claims of piety that one makes.

Kestrel - Just like Sandy Murray, you have NOTHING to add to the discussion. Hot air... Come up with some original ideas or stay on the sidelines.

EPU,
Thanks for mentioning that!
I have attempted to stay clear of partisanship, but I can't help but notice the party affiliation of those intent on foisting a new layer of government upon us, and they weren't Democrats!
Of course, when the party of at least half the city (the 81st House District) and the party of at least a large portion of the other half of the city (80th House District) is referred to in such an openly de-humanizing manner, one's hackles are bound to be ruffled!

A nonpartisan election just means people don't run as a nominee of a party, it doesn't mean they aren't identifiable with a Party. I mean we all Know J. Max has run as a Republican and Sandy Murray has run as the Democrat and secured the Democratic Nomination in the primary on July 31 to run against Mike Jacobs though shortly after the primary she dropped out of that race to run for Mayor.

I think more important is the fact that a the City level we really don't have the social and Welfare issues so the reasons for voting for a Democrat vs. Republican don't exist. So you'll get many folks who aren't voting based on party affiliations but based on who has the better skill set to run the City and its fairly limited set of responsibilities - Police, Roads, Parks, Zoning/Development(including economic). So while at the national level I'm a Dem, I'm voting for J. Max to be Mayor because I think he has a better skill set and better diplomacy skills.

And yea there definitely should not be active political party participation or influence in these political races or in the actual decisions for the City. I mean I think Dems and Republicans share the desire for good parks, sensible development, an effective police department and an efficient government that doesn't raise our taxes.

Murray is identifiable as part of the NOCity DeKalb Democrat bureacracy backers.

Their Democrat agenda has been soundly defeated before by the intelligent voters of Brookhaven, it will be again.

Dean,

Enlighten me, when was this 'resounding defeat' of which you speak?

As a proud contributor to the NOCity DeKalb Democrat bureacracy backers you, Mr. Ehlert will remember all too well how you failed at the polls this summer. The very intelligent voters decided to incorporate despite your campaign of FUD

Dean,
Yes, the 'referendum' did squeak by with a tiny sector of the population even bothering to vote.
I can see why it was so important to the forces intent on installing a new layer of government to place the referendum on a ballot that was sure to draw only limited participation and allow 50% of whatever tiny fraction showed up to determine the governance of 50,000 people.
I certainly understand why you didn't want to ensure that at least 25,000 'yes' votes be required to pass any referendum, as that would never occur.

Mr. Gary, “pay to play”? I guess it all depends on the value system in which you were raised . . .

Please pass the yellow mustard!

Of Course Murray dropped out of the race against Mike Jacobs........He would have chewed her up and spit her out like a wad tobacco. Whether you like Mike Jacobs or not Murray had no qualifications for a run at him...........

Gary,
Did Mrs. Murray receive ANY donations from 'botique city service provision corporations'?

I didn't think so!

Mr. Phil, remind me . . . Which potential vendor did Mr. Russell work for?

Please pass the yellow mustard!

I work for the only ABSOLUTE vendor and employer for that matter that had their voice taken away from them...the citizens of Brookhaven.

Ms. LMBG, “HamBurger, FOCUS! what does Mr. Russell have to do with anything.”

LOL . . . Now? NOTHING!!!

You may want to read this article and pay close attention to the listing of area police departments and populations served. Then factor the various city demographics.

http://tinyurl.com/ardyw4m

TOD – Brookhaven Police Department
http://tinyurl.com/72esjog

“Take a few moments and read the recommendations for yourself. Then ponder what it really means in the context of Brookhaven.”
http://tinyurl.com/7rjpykb

Excuse me, my special hamburger is ready . . . Now please pass the yellow mustard!

Where have these miraculous accomplishments of jmaxjr's you refer to occurred?

Obviously nothing of value has occurred in Ashford Park (or any of 'District 2) as a result of his efforts....

But, I forgot, we don't count so we should all just be quiet and acquiesce to the will of those who know better,....right?

Also, you might want to educate yourself about Police coverage, crime statistics and the increased costs borne by citizens under inadequate Police coverage.

Hey Lets, let’s not forget, J Max has forged a great financial relationship with prospective city vendors that will be bidding on Brookhaven Services. One thing though, the city manager can’t award RFP’s without the Council/Mayor.
Who better than J. Max would know the qualifications of vendors like JAT Consulting, Comdex Consulting, Lowe Engineering?
Who would be better qualified to understand the capabilities of these companies than J. Max?

Let’s you make a great point. Sandy Murray had made no attempt what so ever to forge a financial relationship with any of the potential vendors that our Brookhaven Tax $s will be going too. How would it be possible for Sandy to be unbiased decision when she has no financial ties to them?
http://media.ethics.ga.gov/Search/Campaign/Campaign_ByContributions_RFR.aspx?NameID=18022&FilerID=C2012002379&CDRID=70024&Name=Davis,%20J%20Max&Year=2012&Report=15%20Days%20Before%20Special%20Election%20-%2011/06/2012

"LOL . . . Now? NOTHING!!!"

MY POINT EXACTLY! Thank you finally a NOer that can read!

Yea the Dunwoody Police department after being harangued for apparently having too much time on their hands and writing an excessive amount of traffic tickets is now saying they want more officers. What a surprise, a head of a department lobbying for a bigger budget. GEE WIZ. It must be true!

BTW Dunwoody has to patrol and respond to incidents on the interstate. Dunwoody has a far larger population during the day. Yes Brookhaven has a higher poverty rate but anyone who knows anything knows that undocumented folks or newly arrived immigrants living in poverty have a far lower crime rate than citizens living in poverty.

Maybe more will be needed, but proposing off the bat 100 officers based on some generic national recommendation before looking at the actual crime reports or interviewing your police chiefs? That's just stupid.

Brookhaven4U I asked a question. WHAT HAS SANDY DONE. The silence to that question is telling! Again WHAT HAS SANDY SUCCESSFULLY ACCOMPLISHED IN THE COMMUNITY?

Ms. LMBG, with regard to Mr. Russell, it looks like “pay to play” does not necessarily win at the ballot box in district #2. However, expect it to win in district #1 as this is where the drive for cityhood originated!

Please pass the yellow mustard!

You are mixing up two concepts. No one supports pay to play. And in fact it doesn't exist.

Jim beat Russ because he has a long history serving his community. Just like J. Max has a longer history than Sandy relative to civic activities in the community.

That my friend is and should be the deciding factor.

LMBG
"anyone who knows anything knows that undocumented folks or newly arrived immigrants living in poverty have a far lower crime rate than citizens living in poverty"

Huh?

I guess that is why Arizona is so welcoming of all the newly arrived folks and the tremendous increase in crime that seems to follow them, right?

I also guess you have demonstrated for us just how little you comprehend adequate Police coverage.

Ms. LMBG, WTF? Anyone that votes for J. Max Davis supports “pay to play”. You must have been on a European tour with “M” . . . But, we folks in district #1 accept this odd behavior from conservatives . . . Evidently, other Brookhaven area conservatives think we are not conservative? Maybe because they are not used to flip-flopping democrats?

Please pass the yellow mustard!

Apparently you didn't attend the Candidate Forum/Debate at Ashford Park School.
Mrs. Murray was quite engaged as were the other attending candidates.
As I remember it, that was when one of the Candidates quite brazenly stated that 'Pay To Play' was over in Brookhaven.
Of course, that was before the CCDR's were released!

While I still disagree, it's nice to see you have lowered your expectations!

Bad government is worse, and we all have had our fill of DeKalb Democrat politics.

Mr. Dean, and we still have DeKalb politics and Brookhaven politics. Not much difference, but it is closer and more personal. It is here in what they now call Brookhaven!

Please pass the yellow mustard!

Dean,
All we have is a new, self-absorbed, self-deluded 'majority' that were unable to gain electoral office without carving out a new artificial layer of government.

The intelligent voters of Brookhaven realize the difference comes over the next few years as we enjoy better services with less bureaucratic overhead from the disfunctional entrenched DeKalb Democrat bureacracy.

Dean,
I'm sorry you have such a problem with Democrats.
I am appalled that 'you people' have spent over a year equating 'Democrat' with 'corrupt'.
The most recent election (and the results in our various 'Districts') might demonstrate clearly that even though you have succeeded in inventing a new layer of government, it will still be led by Democrats over time.
Do you understand what a waste of time and money you have been a part of?

Mr. Tom, but we are no longer in DeKalb, right? I mean they are over there and we are over here and we have our own school system, right?

Please pass the yellow mustard!

Kestrel seriously? you blame J. Max Davis? If anything to find the person to blame you need only find the nearest mirror.

You need to relax.

Yes. I blame J Max. Self professed leader of the screw up the neighborhood program.

E Pluri Unum REALLY?

The people tearing apart the community are the small portion of folks still unwilling to accept that Brookhaven is a reality and that its time to move forward.

They are people like Sandy Murray who as never successfully accomplished anything for the community but was the ONLY candidate for Mayor to sling mud and lies in her campaign mail outs. The ONLY candidate for Mayor to post on the Patch in a condescending manner.

It is telling that those most against the City supported Sandy instead of Larry Danese. Larry unlike Sandy was a viable alternative to J. Max, Larry like J. Max has a history of successful community service including but not limited to his service on the Soil and Conservation board. The only logical explanation for supporting Sandy over Larry and J. Max is because the powers that be are convinced that they can get her to leave more city services, like police and parks, and thus taxes, with DeKalb or is more likely to assure the city is not successful.

I Ask the question again. What has Sandy Murray done in the community that demonstrates here ability to successfully lead?

J. Max has served on several community boards and led the successful BrookhavenYes movement that required a great deal of organizational skill.

The forums he helped organize with the Mayors from other cities is evidence of his ability to work with others and knowledge of the issues the new city will face.

As to the theory of those supporting her to keep more services and tax dollars with DeKalb. Is it just coincidence that Sandy Murray was posting that the City of Brookhaven would not take over the services proposed (police, parks, roads, zoning/development"? While her charge was silly and demonstrates a lack of understanding regarding the legislative process since a Charter is not meant to force adoption services but instead allow it, also if the city doesn't tax on the services then they don't collect the revenues associated with them.
The fact is maybe she intent on doing just what she said could happen, that being not taking on the services the people voted for when they approved the city:

http://brookhaven.patch.com/users/sandy-murray/comments

"The current charter absolutely does NOT talk about any services. Read it for yourself. Nothing! No services at all. AND no budget either. "Trust me" those Yesers say! HA!"

"What I meant by the city charter does not guarantee any of the services that the CVI studied. In fact it says nothing about the services the city will offer nor does it say anything about a budget. But oh goody! There's a big pile of money to play with!"

LMBG,

NEWS FLASH:
Your taxes will go up.
The C4ND and BYES Police projections are 1/2 of what is necessary.
Deny all you want, attempting to make reality fit the bogus 'budget' will cause suffering.

Eric,
So what explains the crime statistics (especially violent crime) along the Buford Highway Corridor not only in Brokehaven, but all the way up Buford Highway?

Where has the influx of impoverished immigrants REDUCED crimes of opportunity and violence?

Eddie - the articles all say its lower not non existent.

There are a number of reasons for the Buford Highway corridor to have more crimes.

1. The density of people is far higher.
2. The number of people traveling through and shopping is much highers
3. and there is a higher rate of people living in poverty in the area.

Immigrant, Born in the USA, Citizen, Resident, White, Black, Asian, Mexican, Honduran, Male, Female in all these groups the crime rate is higher for those living below poverty. living below the poverty level is perhaps the biggest factor, unfortunately many people still believe its the color of one's skin or one's nationality.

What the studies show however, is that the first generation immigrants have a lower rate of crime than citizens. Yes if you compare Middle Class Citizens to First generation immigrants living in poverty the first generation immigrants probably have a higher crime rate. But they would have a lower crime rate than the citizens living in poverty.

And that's just one reason to try to reduce the number of people living in poverty.

I thought the quotes were fairly self explanatory but I do understand this is a layered topic that's tough to address on a message board.

But this is all to the point that you can't just look at raw national averages to make policing decisions.

Bottom line, I did do a spit take when I read your cite of Sheriff

Eric,
You should spend more time in Districts 2 and 4.

And you should spend more time on Buford Highway.

Mr. Eric, please take J. Max down to Buford Highway next time you go. Help him become acquainted with that area of his new city that he rarely visits.

Make sure you tell him although he likes yellow mustard with his chili, it is out of place on tacos!

Phil,
What a twisted attempt at logic.

I am voting FOR Mrs. Murray, and if offered the ballot 100 times, I would not vote FOR her opponent!

Tom,

You miss the date.
It 'started' when a certain State Representative first exposed his screwball plans to an unsuspecting public almost two years ago.

The rest is history.

And as to 'opinions of politicians don't pay the mortgage', that's why it's best to have as few politicians as possible and no 'mortgage'.

Tom,
Just wait until the first or second year property tax bills roll in.
There won't be any more questions about the 'rifts'.

It's above Rebecca's pay grade.

Mr BQPQ, yes indeed! However, I am voting for Rebecca Chase Williams just the same! I want J. Max Davis to have intellectual company!

Please pass the yellow mustard!

Troy,
Did Sandy accept campaign contributions from ANY of the CORPORATIONS that EXPECT to do business with Brokehaven?

Ms. A Resident, since when have elderly retired individuals become corporations? It is interesting that you continue to alienate individuals that may be of benefit to the new city in the future.

Want to see a list of corporations known for their “pay to play” political contributions? Just look at J. Max Davis’s list of contributors!

Please pass the yellow mustard!

residue,
You confuse CITIZENS with an inherent interest in THEIR community with CORPORATIONS hoping to PROFIT FROM US.
Jack Abramoff has good reason to suggest the best solution is to make permanently illegal ANY campaign contribution from any individual or entity hoping for contracts from any government representative. Abramoff, should know.

Mr A Res, like yourself, the Imlay's and Cousins are concerned citizens that happen to live in our city footprint.
They are not companies that are bidding/profiting on our tax payer dollars.
Those companies that are planning on profiting from our Tax payer dollar are in on the JMAX pay for play.

There you have it! They want a puppet that they can controll. Sandy is very weak and does not possess the skills necessary to lead anything. And down here in the 4th, neither does Gebbia or Lord. Lord's own campaigner stated "if you don't like her, vote for someone else next year!" Gebbia stated "It's going to be on-the-job-training" Neither have ever participated in thier communities, until now. Witt was the better candidate, I hope he runs next year. .

Brokehaven Resident,
I understand you must have an issue with absorbing facts.
Why 'you people' think that ensuring the entire 'byes' cabal's election is required is beyond me.
Just wait until the budget is out and people see why it is important to keep as many little byes paws away from the levers of power as possible.